but
the cosworth one will be better due the the cosworth badge
:p :p (sorry for the rubbish reply)
[Edited on 24/7/09 by eccsmk]
3.0 Alfa V6 Vs Cosworth V6
pro and cons on each please
im not a specialist on these engines
but
the cosworth one will be better due the the cosworth badge
:p :p
(sorry for the rubbish reply)
[Edited on 24/7/09 by eccsmk]
cossie
Alfa - ally block so lighter, the 3.2 has 250 BHP - also looks stunning
Cossie - Iron Block I think, only 200BHP and heavy ugly thing 
if its a cosworth GAA , then i would think cossie too .
otherwise its the alfa .
GAA? Not exactly two a penny these days.
The mad beating heart of a tempramental Italian anyday!
(But then I don't have to service it / put up with any potential un-reliabilty issues!)
Mike
choose the cossie, if you want to reach the end of your drive without it breaking
Ah but is it better to break at the end of your drive or at the end of a run?
I think i'd take end of the drive if the end of the run is south of France!
maybe.
Ask Claire - she's got one and seems to like it so much she's bought a car with one fitted.
Alfa (should have done a poll 
)
I might be just a little biased in this
BOA with BOB cams, nice clean air and exhaust, uprated injectors and fuel pressure regulator and an atermarket ECU and you would be well north of
300bhp for notta lotta wonga...
I would choose the Alfa. Out of interest, what gearbox can you mate it to in RWD format?
Claire's V6 is a Mazda, an entirely different kettle of fish. As indeed is Claire.
Geoff.
Claires V6 is in an Alfa 164 and is an Alfa!!
I would choose and Alfa because I did and it cost me -£8.
[Edited on 24/7/09 by owelly]
you are all wrong.....lol, well kinda
claire's fury has a ford probe V6 in it, the ford/ mazda engine.
claire's alfa 164 has the alfa V6 in it
OWELLY where on gods green earth did you get an alfa V6 for £8! u2u me your secrets!
[Edited on 24/7/09 by omega0684]
A 164 donor car cost us £42 off Ebay. We sold £30 worth of spares and cashed the rest in for £20. The engine cost -£8!!!
Keep looking on Ebay (a search for ALPHA sometimes finds hidden cars!) and also in the local Ad-mag type papers.
did you have the engine reconditioned at all?
cossie,so much more reliyable also if you turbo it you can twin turbo it mega power.
but you wont need to do that,
cossie good for 300hp or more
Normally i'm the Ford camp, but it's no contest..the Alfa V6 has often been called the best sounding engine ever made. Both kick out about 200bhp; lob a Megasquirt on it and thats the remains of the italian electrics removed...leaving just a jewel of an engine.
quote:
Originally posted by NeilP
I might be just a little biased in this
BOA with BOB cams, nice clean air and exhaust, uprated injectors and fuel pressure regulator and an atermarket ECU and you would be well north of 300bhp for notta lotta wonga...
the cossie parts carnt be any harder to find than the alfas
[Edited on 24/7/09 by jpindy3]
alex is the pinto getting the boot???
quote:
Originally posted by jpindy3
the cossie parts carnt be any harder to find than the alfas
[Edited on 24/7/09 by jpindy3]
quote:
Originally posted by owelly
Claires V6 is in an Alfa 164 and is an Alfa!!
I would choose and Alfa because I did and it cost me -£8.
[Edited on 24/7/09 by owelly]
quote:
Originally posted by jpindy3
alex is the pinto getting the boot???
don't know where im going to build it yet though? i need to convince dad to extend the
garage to a double
quote:
Originally posted by GrumpyOne
quote:
Originally posted by jpindy3
the cossie parts carnt be any harder to find than the alfas
[Edited on 24/7/09 by jpindy3]
The timing gear (chain etc) is non existent for the BOB, I have managed to find four of the five parts needed and so far it has cost me nearly £600 and the chain will cost another £250 if I can find one.
Alfa. getting a litle rarer to find a cheapy on fleabay now, but they do pop up now and again (usually still attched to a bloody big car)
The main reason to go alfa
SOUND
if going for a V6 I would go with a newer engine from the japanese side of the ocean.
3.5L
Toyota 2GR-FSE 315 PS (311 hp/232 kW) at 6,400 RPM (direct injection found in lexus)
or the normal
Toyota 2GR-FE 268 hp (200 kW) at 6200 rpm
All alloy block and head, service weight is around 160-170kg but loose the aircon etc would drop its weight even further!
[Edited on 25/7/09 by nz_climber]
If I ever do actually build a car, it'll have the 2.5L Alfa V6 I have in the garage once I've rebuilt it. The new Alfa V6 is actually a GM
unit that Alfa work over, so make sure you get the older version. The 3.2 with the GTA inlet cams, a decent exhaust and inlet set up should have near
on 280ish bhp. It's 255bhp at 6200 rpm as standard and it'll take more without any bother. With the plans I have for my 2.5L, it should have
near 220-230 bhp up around 7-7,500 rpm. And it'll be in a single seater if I'm brave enough. 
So basically, Alfa all the way. They also sound pretty tasty and rev well. Which are important for me. Parts, even tuning parts aren't that much,
although cams can be a fair bit. But then they will be for any quad cam engine. Have a look here
for tuning bits.
Its got to be the Alfa V6, voted best engine in the world in mid 90S and sounds awesome.
Reliability is not an issue on the v6, especially the 12v. Better than the Cossy I would say. Alfas reputation for unreliability was around car
electric’s and body rust, not V6 engines.
Latter 16v 4 cylinders had significant problems but the V6 never coughs.
There cheap, I paid £40 for the entire car and the engine started and ran from day1, 200BHp 200LbsT off the shelf , very broad torque curve makes for
fantastic tractability.
If moneys not a problem then there may be other V6s out there, but realistically I don’t think you can beat it.
Of course I’m totally biased
[img][/img]
quote:
Originally posted by Johnmor
If moneys not a problem then there may be other V6s out there, but realistically I don’t think you can beat it.
You have just misesed a full alfa i64 on fleabay
went for £155.
The KV6, comes in 2.0 and 2.5 i think (thiner lines to get bigger bore)
about 170 bhp iirc and is similar to the k4 in the HGF problems.
weight is about 150kg ish
I was quoted £550 from a breakers last week for one.
quote:
Originally posted by Trev Borg
about 170 bhp iirc and is similar to the k4 in the HGF problems.
quote:
Originally posted by Johnmor
Its got to be the Alfa V6, voted best engine in the world in mid 90S and sounds awesome.
Reliability is not an issue on the v6, especially the 12v. Better than the Cossy I would say. Alfas reputation for unreliability was around car electric’s and body rust, not V6 engines.
Latter 16v 4 cylinders had significant problems but the V6 never coughs.
There cheap, I paid £40 for the entire car and the engine started and ran from day1, 200BHp 200LbsT off the shelf , very broad torque curve makes for fantastic tractability.
If moneys not a problem then there may be other V6s out there, but realistically I don’t think you can beat it.
Of course I’m totally biased
Engine in car 2
quote:
Originally posted by SPYDER
quote:
Originally posted by owelly
Claires V6 is in an Alfa 164 and is an Alfa!!
I would choose and Alfa because I did and it cost me -£8.
[Edited on 24/7/09 by owelly]
I stand corrected. I was confusing Claire and Clairetoo.
I think.
Sorry.
This is not good news as I was planning on building an Alfa V6 engined fury.
What are the issues with fitment?
The biggest problem is the right bank of cylinders is the rear-most one - and in a Fury chassis that means moving the pedal box back about four
inch's
Whereas the Mazda V6 has the right side cylinders set forward - plus it's shorter than a crossflow anyway 
Thats a bit of a bummer!
You just don't realise what a big lump it is!
Probably being a bit naive but I thought as you can get a V8 in there the V6 wouldn't have been a problem.
What car can I put it in instead? There's a guy putting one in a Dax Rush and one in a Luego Viento, but I wanted a full bodied car if poss.
The Rover V6 is a 90deg V, so its a bit tighter to fit in.
Other V6s or interest are the Vaux (Omega) 3.0 V6 and the Duratec (Jaguar) 3.0 V6. The Vaux is a 54deg and the Jag is 60deg, so both nice neat
installs.
The Jag V6 has 240bhp standard, and fitted with Jenveys and an Emerald ECU makes 270bhp. With hot cams you'll be over 300bhp. Torque is over
200lb ft.
Don't worry too much about gearbox issues, a carefully machined adaptor plate will let you fit whatever box you want.
Haven't seen into either the Alpha or the Vaux V6, but the Jag one has a bottom end like something out of the Titanic. I reckon the bottom end
must be near bullet proof as standard, and as normal peak power is high up 6-7k rpm, its a real screamer of an engine.
For sound, look up Andy Burton's Pug 306 Cosworth. Its a Duratec V6. Think 6R4 on steroids and you won't go far wrong.
Oh yeh, and the Duratec V6 comes with solid tappets as standard, is all alloy, and the built engine minus all the gubbins (altenator, starter, plenum
etc) is only 130kgs.
Willie
Hey Claire - the Mazda KL-E V6 from the Probe/MX6/626 etc sounds amazing too. A guy fitted one to an MX5 with motorbike throttle bodies. He has a
video (and soundtrack) on youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocQ_R5MO7Vc
http://www.miata.net/motm/2007/snell.html
However the Mazda guru on miata.net who was involved with this particular engine strongly advised against it being used in a north/south orientation
since it was only ever designed for a transverse position and he thought that oil starvation would be a big problem - I hope that hasn't
eventuated for you. (the rear wheel drive V6 Mazdas are J series and unrelated to the K series Mazda V6. However the Suzuki 4WD V6 is closely based
on the K series but stands much taller) Chris on the miata.net forum is putting one into his MX5 and mentions a friend with one in a Fisher Fury
(http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=345272) - maybe that is you?
I love Alfas too and had a 164 12v V6 - what an awesome engine! The sound and sportiness of the power delivery! The other Italian V6 I'd like
to use is a 1967 Fiat Dino 2 litre V6 I have as a box of bits in my garage - anyone got experience with these all alloy, quad cam, triple weber -
based on an early F1 Ferrari engine?
Fantastic build there Claire - and I see you are very familiar with the links I posted, judging by your photo archive - and probably know a lot more
about it than I do, lol.
But in answer to those wondering why anyone would want to use a V6 when turbo/supercharging or a V8 is easier - I guess it is something about the
sound, power delivery and agility that a light sports engine can deliver. There is more to a sports engine than horsepower IMHO. Thats why I'm
interested in using a 40 year old V6 that is pretty low on bhp and torque by today's standards. After being a passenger in a top-down Fiat Dino
Spider tearing up the twisting roads of the Port Hills in Christchurch (NZ) at 8000 rpm I'm hooked.
Hiya - and thanks for the compliments !
I have seen the joyful noise miata - but not untill some time after I had finished mine , hence the few differences in the methods used
I am indeed involved in Chris's Mx5 conversion - I started by supplying the adapter plate and exchange midiyied gearbox , then throttle bodies ,
and I'm currently building a tubular front subframe to make room for a decent capacity sump .
There sure is something to be said of the sound of an uncorked V6 singing along at 8000 rpm - it's not all about brute horsepower
