Hi everyone im calling on anyone that can help ...
I know its long but i want to explain it properly as im no mechanic

Thanks to locostmadandy i got my megasquirt wiring right ... That is the good news

So i think im all set to start it up finally ....

Errrm WRONG !!!

I turned it over with fuel pump disconnected and i have spark finally (turns over perfect)

Connect pump turn it over then and after a few turns big clunk / bang !!!

I tried again and it wouldn't turn over just one click

Tried to turn over by hand and its solid

After throwing a spanner and calming down i spoke to Andy who recommended checking the Vr housing had not got lose and gone into the fly wheel witch i did by removing starter and its fine ....

I thought id try to turn it over again by hand with starter still removed and it does ???

Put starter back in disconnect pump crank it all day long with no issues

Connect fuel pump turns over a few times then locks up again

Try to turn over by hand its solid

remove starter again and it turns by hand !!



The flywheel is a tiger racing lightened one and the starter i have no idea but both where on my 1.8 and worked fine ...
The only thing i have had done to the starter is i took it in a place that recon them as it wouldn't throw out every time you turned the key on the old engine and they replaced the gear

I think its down to this as why else would the engine turn freely again after removing it the question is why does it do it when the engines firing trying to start ?

I have the old gear bit they replace if anyone could take mine apart and compare ?

I will ring them tomorow and see what they say also ....


Ryan

Hydraulic lock? Fuel filling the cylinders?

Andy suggested this but it turns over freely as soon as i remove starter and does sound like metal on metal when it locks .. so surely its the starter ?

starter

Maccmike ... Do you know why it appears normal and doesn't jam when pumps not running and cranking but jam's when its trying to fire ?

sounds like the starter is sticking in as it tries to fire are you sure you have the plug leads in the right order you may be firing out of order ie 180 degrees out

I dont sorry, but if it didnt throw out all the time before, the recon could be preventing it returning. starter fault would be the first thing id look at. If its road worthy, try to jump start it without starter fitted. Im friendly with a salvage yard purely on mutual interests and they'll lend me any part to fault diagnose. If you can do that also its a great way of tracing faults for free. give an update when you try solutions as id be interested

Cheers lad's

Plug's are in order checked many times but ill check again

I thought about bump starting also but its not fit for the road yet and my drives gravel

Like you say i could do with borrowing a starter and see what happens

mine is not a lucas707 its the smaller one cant remember number ...

But i doubt unless someone on here locals got one ill have 2 buy one

have you modified the sump on the zetec it does nees a section cutting out and a plate rewelding (creating a small recess)as this causes the starter to sit at the wrong angle if not modified

Yes mate i cut the alloy section of the sump to make room for starter so it fits properly

Surely if that where the case it would not turn it over normally without fuel ?

Thanks

I take it you are using the CVH or DOHC starter from the sierra and not the standard sierra one. If you are using the stanstard sierra one you need the 14mm spacer if not the starter will throw beyond the flywheel. Just looking at he simple possibilities for you

Im unsure of the starters exact identity but worked absolutely fine with the same flywheel on my 1.8 zetec last year and did not have spacers when i removed to my knowledge

When the fuel is disconnected and the engine is turning over freely on the starter, is it turning the right way ? I had brushes replaced on starter once and they wired it up wrongly. If the engine fires and turns the pinion against the way it wants to turn, it might lock up.

Try taking the plugs out when you spin it over with fuel

The locking up problem sounds like a soloniod throwing out but not turning.
I had a big problem with a Mondeo starter jamming.
If it only jams when the fuel pump is running then it's an electrical problem, isolate both, check all earths as the starter will draw a lot of amps, set up a manual switched starting system and have a switch in the fuel pump circuit so you can crank then throw the switch to the pump.

i am with snapper on this one !!

assuming the starter is definitely the correct one its pretty much the only other possibility. you could also try it by disconnecting the negative on the battery after it jams just to check its the solenoid that's jamming

Just to throw in my tuppence worth,
I also believe its the starter causing the
locking up. You need to get it tested
or try a substitute motor,to be sure.
The injectors wont throw in enough
fuel in a couple of turns to hydraulic the
engine.

Andy

Thanks all i think another starter is needed to see what happens

just hope i can find one to try this weekend


Ill keep you all posted

Ryan

I had exactly this problem a couple of weeks ago!

The symptoms were identical, as previously suggested, it was the starter. When the starter was fitted, it was a really tight fit to the sump, just enough to not sit quite square. As a result it would occasionally jam the pinion, effectively locking the engine solid. In my case, re-fitting the starte very carefully was enough to cure the problem, and it's been fine since.

Cheers

Adrian

Thanks Adrian i will check again but i wasn't shy with the grinder when i modified the sump ...

Did yours turn over without the engine firing ?


Spoke to the guy who changed the gear / pinion waste of time he said defiantly not to do with him but might be starter its self so not to helpful ...


Ryan

Yes, it turned over fine, just wouldn't catch, then bang, wouldn't budge!

Im on it now mate im positive the fitment is fine but i will check again as it seems unlikely we would have thew same problem with different causes ?

Im hopefully going to get another starter to try tonight also if my mate has one ..

Ignition timing way way out and firing early causing the piston to stall as it rises in the bore??. take the plugs out ground to the block ( to save the coil )and remove the fuel pump fuse. Crank over and check the timing with a strobe light.

starter fitment is fine i looked in with a light and the starter gear was jammed in the flywheel ..

Omega? Would timing cause the starter to jam in the flywheel ?

cheers

Thats what mine did. Solenoid pulled the pinion out, then slight misalignment caused it to jam hard against the ring gear, so that it wouldn't retract. Sounds like you've looked at this several times now though, so maybe we did have identical symptoms with different causes?

Good luck sorting it out.

Cheers

Adrian

Has the replacement gear you mentioned got the right amount of teeth? ,I know some starters had one more or less and if one with an extra tooth is fitted it tends to bind up.I found this from experience with a cross-flow when i fitted a sierra starter motor.
Paul

both have same amount of teeth pal

My mate don't have the right one so no luck there and i got pulled on the way and a £60 fine

Not a good day