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Zetec Map assistance please?

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 12:28 PM

Hi Guys new to the site but have browsed as a guest for some time.

I have recently fitted a 2.0 litre Blacktop Zetec (new) running N/A on Twin Weber 45s , Running a mega jolt supplied by trigger wheels and a TPS from Weber. New coil pack, cables , loom etc...

The Megajolt came with a MAP from Trigger wheels but i just cant get the car to go.

I can start it and it will tick over nicely (ish) i realise i need carbs jetting / balancing but i need to get there first.

As soon as i give it any revs the engine goes all sluggish and then starts to rev high when i take my foot off the throttle.

Getting angry with it now. im sure the maps wrong , so wondered if anybody has a working map for a megajolt running 45s and TPS that i could have, or a pick of any other makes map so i can input the figures myself.

Really appreciate any help here guys

Thanks

Paul

Jenko - 27/5/14 at 12:54 PM

Before you start, make sure that mega jolt is advancing the ignition. The map may not be optimum, but should work ok to see the engine revving as expected. Get a timing light on the engine and check it's advancing.

Assuming you are running Edis 4, then irrespective as to what the megajolt is doing, you would still see a limp home advance (10 degrees rings a bell), so this can mask any problems further down the line.

Norfolkluegojnr - 27/5/14 at 01:34 PM

can you post up your map? we can probably advise best from there....

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 01:45 PM

Here's a pic of the map

Jenko - 27/5/14 at 02:07 PM

Map looks fine for a zetec.(have a quick look on google images for zetec ignition map).......approx tick over 12degs, full advance under full load IRO 30degs....As previously mentioned, I really don't think the map is at fault.

Before diagnosing anything else, the carbs DO need balancing, this should be done before you think about map adjustments. does the ignition cell marker move around with revs AND load?.

Other important things to make sure of is the VR sensor is mounted correctly (assume it's through the block to the back of the fly wheel), the signal from VR needs to be good.

Check ignition leads are all going to the correct cylinder - sounds obvious I know, but it does happen. But you really need to be 100% sure you are getting an advancing ignition, and don't trust what the computer says, it needs the timing light.

Norfolkluegojnr - 27/5/14 at 02:10 PM

That doesn't look to bad to my untrained eye.

have you had it plugged it with the engine running? is it advancing around the grid as the TPS and Revs change?

If its hunting, or won't rev through the range I'd have thought thats more likely a fuelling issue or air leak issue, which without having the right jets etc will be difficult to diagnose.

any chance of an air leak around the manifold?

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 02:32 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Norfolkluegojnr
That doesn't look to bad to my untrained eye.

have you had it plugged it with the engine running? is it advancing around the grid as the TPS and Revs change?

If its hunting, or won't rev through the range I'd have thought thats more likely a fuelling issue or air leak issue, which without having the right jets etc will be difficult to diagnose.

any chance of an air leak around the manifold?

How do i check fueling / air leaks ??

what pressure should my facet be pushing??

cheers Paul

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 02:33 PM

And forgot to say it does not seem to go over the first couple of boxes on the load.

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 02:38 PM

I have had it running when the pc is connected , but as above it doesnt seem to go through the load , which should be the TPS ???

How do i check for fueling / air leaks?

what pressure should my pump be at?

cheers Paul

Norfolkluegojnr - 27/5/14 at 02:38 PM

start engine, spray some WD40 or similar around the edge, you'll notice the pitch of the engine change as it seals briefly. Should help you identify. Or just pop it of, clean, and refit.

1.5 - 2.5 psi for pressure I believe.

Jenko - 27/5/14 at 02:55 PM

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare
And forgot to say it does not seem to go over the first couple of boxes on the load.

If it had air leaks, then quite often the issue is more apparent at tick over, as the butterflies are closed and thus, there is far more vacume in the intet at tick over.

With the engine off (ignition on), if you push the throttle pedal, do you get a full swing from 0 to 90 on the throttle load axis?. If not, have you performed the tps calibration set up?.

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 02:59 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Jenko

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare
And forgot to say it does not seem to go over the first couple of boxes on the load.

If it had air leaks, then quite often the issue is more apparent at tick over, as the butterflies are closed and thus, there is far more vacume in the intet at tick over.

With the engine off (ignition on), if you push the throttle pedal, do you get a full swing from 0 to 90 on the throttle load axis?. If not, have you performed the tps calibration set up?.

I believe i have , as i press the throttle the TPS clock moves round from 0 - 100.

but under revving the box does not seem to travel along and down the graph as it should.

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 03:01 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Jenko

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare
And forgot to say it does not seem to go over the first couple of boxes on the load.

If it had air leaks, then quite often the issue is more apparent at tick over, as the butterflies are closed and thus, there is far more vacume in the intet at tick over.

With the engine off (ignition on), if you push the throttle pedal, do you get a full swing from 0 to 90 on the throttle load axis?. If not, have you performed the tps calibration set up?.

just re read this and no it does not travel from 0-90 down the throttle load axis, but the throttle clock rotates.

Norfolkluegojnr - 27/5/14 at 03:10 PM

even without the TPS calibrated, it should give you a usable 2D map. I used mine this way for a few months before getting the TPS sensor fitted.

Does the box move right with the engine running? i.e. is it recognising a change in engine revolution?

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 03:14 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Norfolkluegojnr
even without the TPS calibrated, it should give you a usable 2D map. I used mine this way for a few months before getting the TPS sensor fitted.

Does the box move right with the engine running? i.e. is it recognising a change in engine revolution?

Boys when i get home i will check if the box moves across with the revs as im sure it does but im starting to doubt my sanity at the moment when this engine is concerned.

i will let you know later.

Paul

Norfolkluegojnr - 27/5/14 at 03:14 PM

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare

quote:
Originally posted by Norfolkluegojnr
even without the TPS calibrated, it should give you a usable 2D map. I used mine this way for a few months before getting the TPS sensor fitted.

Does the box move right with the engine running? i.e. is it recognising a change in engine revolution?

Boys when i get home i will check if the box moves across with the revs as im sure it does but im starting to doubt my sanity at the moment when this engine is concerned.

i will let you know later.

Paul

keep us posted

Jenko - 27/5/14 at 03:23 PM

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare

quote:
Originally posted by Jenko

quote:
Originally posted by bigbadsquare
And forgot to say it does not seem to go over the first couple of boxes on the load.

If it had air leaks, then quite often the issue is more apparent at tick over, as the butterflies are closed and thus, there is far more vacume in the intet at tick over.

With the engine off (ignition on), if you push the throttle pedal, do you get a full swing from 0 to 90 on the throttle load axis?. If not, have you performed the tps calibration set up?.

just re read this and no it does not travel from 0-90 down the throttle load axis, but the throttle clock rotates.

OK...we need to be clear on this....The throttle load on the left hand side of the ignition table, should (even with the engine not running, but with the ignition on) go from the 0 box (with no throttle), to 90 with full throttle. If this is not the case then this needs to be sorted out........I't may not be the sole reason for the system not working, but you do need to get any working issues ironed out before you start thinking of running the car.

Sorry to harp on, but have you tried the timing light?....you need to be 100% sure that the ignition is doing what it should. It should be easy as I think the zetec has timing marks on the pully and block.....tipex is great at highlighting these, and it's very obvious that the ignition is advancing if you have a timing light on it while revving the engine.

bigbadsquare - 27/5/14 at 06:01 PM

Right the cursor will not go beyond 5 on the load scale even when the pedal is flat to the floor , I have re calibrated the tps and that still goes from 0-100% when throttle closed to full throttle. Do I need to do something with the load bins on the advance correction ?