I took my 12 month rebuilt 893 Locoblade for its first journey at speeds of over 30 mph today.
All was well until I went to change up from 4th and could I hell find 5th gear! Tried it with the engine on and off, at all sorts of speeds etc, but
to no avail.
I remember when I bought it that the owner (Ceebmoj on here) mentioned something to do with speed/rev matching in certain gears, but I can't
remember exactly what he said!
Am I being daft?! Any input would be great!
Just for interest, here's the car in question 
........
Not wanting to sound daft but are you counting the one down and the rest up?! ie. You're not counting first? I only mention it as I had a bloke who wanted me to fix his bike as he couldn't find five gears. He hadn't realised first was down and the rest up!
Thanks for the reply. I see you're only down the road from me?
I've got 1st back, then 2nd, 3rd and 4th are forwards 
You do not need to speed match going up the box, just foot off the gas and nudge it into the next gear, you will need the clutch coming down. It
sounds like you need to drop the sump and have a looksee for something bent
[Edited on 8/3/15 by mark chandler]
Yes matey, just along the coast! What you need is a trackday at Blyton Park on Friday! That'll fix your gearbox!
Haha, yes! Callan was telling me about that when I bought a spare engine off him.
Before I delve too deeply, could it be that my gear lever pivot point isn't far enough back?
Obviously I push the stick, which pulls the gear sleeve for 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th, does it need to pull the same amount for 5th as is does for the
others?
It shouldn't need to move any further to get each gear. It selects and then returns to the same place each time so if you can get one gear, you should be able to get them all!
Damn, ok, cheers. Any other suggestions before I take it to pieces?
Simple to take apart, so just do it.
Sound likes a drum/forks failure of some kind.
My experience with the 893 was that the gear dogs were made from the same chocolate as used in the later R1 device. Clearly unlikely to be an issue
here, since the damage is normally self-limiting, they round/break off making holding a gear difficult.
The 893 dogs aren't undercut (or weren't on any of my gearboxes), making damaging things far easier.
If you require a Haynes Blade manual (92-99), I do have one, favourably priced, in good health.
Before you rip the engine down, is it possible to remove the gear linkage on the engine, and add a bike gear lever
and try again to see if the gears are actually there
steve
What happens when you go for 5th, does it just stay in 4th or do you get a false neutral? Does the gearlever still move the full distance as though
it's changing gear?
[Edited on 9/3/15 by MikeRJ]
Thanks for the ideas everyone.
Mike, it feels like it's hitting 'the end of the line' when I try to find 5th. all the other gears are definite notches, whereas 5th
feels like its jamming/hitting against something. If I try to change into 5th, I hit this stop and it just stays in 4th.
It doesn't jump into/out of any other gears and 1 up to 4 is as easy as 4 down to 1.
This may (probably will) sound stupid, but are you trying to move the lever 5 times? from first to fifth is only 4 movements.
Don't mean to offend, but stranger things happen 
Haha, I've done dafter things, that's for sure!
But no, I've currently got 1st back and 2, 3, 4 forward, plus when I'm doing 40mph+ its revving more than it should be if I was in 5th
accidentally
Does the 893 have 5 gears or 6? the 919 has six, so you may have lost 2 gears not just one!
I'd whip the sump off and have a look up and see if the forks look bent/damaged
Have you tried slipping the clutch a bit while trying to select 5th?
quote:
Originally posted by Matt21
Does the 893 have 5 gears or 6? the 919 has six, so you may have lost 2 gears not just one!
I'd whip the sump off and have a look up and see if the forks look bent/damaged
Have you tried slipping the clutch a bit while trying to select 5th?
I don't know as I am not familiar with bike engines, but when you pull to shift I assume you are moving an arm on the gearbox, does this arm return to a "neutral" position, or does it have a 1,N,2,3,4,5 positions? If so could it be that when it tries for fourth it is fowling on something?
No Matt, I haven't tried slipping the clutch, but will give it a go this week. Looks like we're both having issues at the moment!
Yes, theduck, that is the sequence of gears, but the stick returns to the same neutral point after each gear.
Luckily I have a couple of spare engines I can open up and practice on before I start taking the main one to pieces!
If I do start stripping it down, is there a good online guide anywhere or will my Haynes manual cover it?
quote:
Originally posted by Boylers11
No Matt, I haven't tried slipping the clutch, but will give it a go this week. Looks like we're both having issues at the moment!
Yes, theduck, that is the sequence of gears, but the stick returns to the same neutral point after each gear.
Luckily I have a couple of spare engines I can open up and practice on before I start taking the main one to pieces!
If I do start stripping it down, is there a good online guide anywhere or will my Haynes manual cover it?
Take the sump off the engine in the car, jack the front as high as you can so you can get under and have a good look too
There's no need to practice on another engine as all you can do is look, if you see anything there its an engine out jobby anyway.
While your looking up into the engine, if there's nothing obvious then flick the gear lever and try and get it into all the gears, this might
reveal something, you'll probably need someone to help as it will be easier for them to sit in the car and use the gear lever and clutch if
needed to allow it to go in all the gears.
Right, rather large update on this issue (thanks for the help previously).
I took the car out round the block a couple of times on Saturday morning. I found 5th and 6th eventually, by keeping the gear lever held forward
slightly longer before it 'clunked' into gear like the other gears. All was fine until I was in 5th on my way home ~40mph, then I lost all
drive altogether in any gear, so I pulled over.
The engine was making a fowl noise (like something broken inside being chucked around) and not one gear would give me drive, so I was thinking, get
towed home, then sump off time for engine/gearbox rebuild.
I was being towed home (with my foot on the clutch as I wasn't sure where I was in the gearbox), then the rear near side half shaft jumps out and
I'm on 3 wheels, so we stopped and I waited for the RAC.
So I'm presuming that the gearbox had jammed, causing the propshaft to lock and the half shaft to be spat out of the English axle!! (The brand
new wheel bearing remained in the axle).
So now, I am left with major work and a car on 3 wheels!
I have 2 spare engines of unknown condition, so do I:
1.) Rebuild the current engine/gearbox with spares from the other engine?
or
2.) Bolt my carbs onto a spare engine and hope it works?
Then do I rebuild the rear axle completely or try and source another one?
My main worry is that the half shaft came loose and slid out of the axle. The bearing was fitted correctly and was extremely tight, but as there are
no drum retaining blots, it's the sheer tightness of the rear wheel bearing that holds the whole thing in place!
Any advice/suggestions would be great, as I'm currently at the end of my tether.
What?
Don't quite understand, you didn't put any bolts in to the half-shaft retaining plate? Did the shrink fit retaining collar come off?
[Edited on 16/3/15 by DW100]
Yes I put the 4 bolts in and the retaining collar on!
[Edited on 16/3/15 by Boylers11]
As DW says, that doesn't quite add up.
I'd suggest the bearing wasn't fitted correctly and allowed the shaft to come out. As the splines have left the diff, you lost all drive
(and you'd get a racket from the engine/transmission). Then you've tries towing and the shaft has come out completely.
The only way the shaft can do that is if the retaining collar isn't fitted correctly or the bearing retaining cover bolts come out.
Fix the shaft first and get someone to check what you've done. Then ifthere's still no drive look at the engine.
A BEC without a load on the gearbox sounds as if the box is dropping out.
I agree with the previous comments re the axle, and would say that you have too much travel on the gear lever, making gear changes difficult, I had
50mm movement each way.
quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
As DW says, that doesn't quite add up.
I'd suggest the bearing wasn't fitted correctly and allowed the shaft to come out. As the splines have left the diff, you lost all drive (and you'd get a racket from the engine/transmission). Then you've tries towing and the shaft has come out completely.
The only way the shaft can do that is if the retaining collar isn't fitted correctly or the bearing retaining cover bolts come out.
Fix the shaft first and get someone to check what you've done. Then ifthere's still no drive look at the engine.
Thanks again everyone. Yes 40inch, that's exactly what mine sounds like now. Perhaps the engines ok after all!
With regards to the half shaft and bearing, it was 100% correct, the bearing and retaining and hub plate nuts were all spot on! However, on examining
the shaft splines tonight, they've been stripped bare almost, so I'll need a new one of those. While I'm taking the axle to pieces to
clean it of any metal particles, are there any worthwhile jobs doing while I'm at it?
Presumably, if the splines wore and jammed, that'd be enough for the shaft to be spat out of the bearing?
Are half shafts available brand new? I have stumbled across a few axle/diff rebuild kits on the tinterweb too, should I give one of these a go?
quote:
Originally posted by Boylers11
Thanks again everyone. Yes 40inch, that's exactly what mine sounds like now. Perhaps the engines ok after all!
With regards to the half shaft and bearing, it was 100% correct, the bearing and retaining and hub plate nuts were all spot on! However, on examining the shaft splines tonight, they've been stripped bare almost, so I'll need a new one of those. While I'm taking the axle to pieces to clean it of any metal particles, are there any worthwhile jobs doing while I'm at it?
Presumably, if the splines wore and jammed, that'd be enough for the shaft to be spat out of the bearing?
I'd have thought exactly the same to be honest.
I'll get some pictures tomorrow evening
As said by many, somethings not right there on the axle. If the half shaft has come out with the bearing still on the shaft, then the retaining plate
on the axle end isn't fitted. It's impossible to come out otherwise. If the axle has had a disc conversion then normally a spacer plate is
supplied to replace the drum back plate thickness, if that's been fitted on it's own without the bearing retaining plate then that's
why the bearing has come out....there's nothing holding it in!.
If on the other had the bearing is still in the axle, then the locking ring wasn't fitted behind the bearing on the half shaft or it wasn't
tight.
A couple of pictures will enable a quick diagnosis of the axle problem.
Ian
Below are some pictures.
I'm taking the rear axle out anyway to give the internals a look over to make sure there's no damage.
Do the splines on the shaft look reusable I.e is there enough depth to them?
From the picture of the hub, you can see the retaining collar left inside, with it's ribbed inner surface and the shaft has a slightly ribbed
texture too.
Ok, the bearings stayed in the axle and the halfshaft has slipped out of the bearing and retaining collar. The halfshaft looks to have some damage in
the bearing and retainer area (perhaps from a previous bearing change some time in it's life) which could quite easily lead to the retainer ring
not being as tight a fit as it should be. Along with a bit of damage on the splines, i would swap both shafts and then you know it's right.
Ian