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Another zetec / type 9 fitting question.
emwmarine - 9/10/16 at 03:30 PM

Ok, so i'm just fitting the starter motor to my type 9 / zetec combination.

I had to do a little more cutting away of the webbing than I had originally envisaged to make room for the starter motor.

However, it still doesn't quite fit. The round rear edge of the starter motor just - only just fouls the sump where the steel and aluminium sumps join and stick out slightly. I could grind a mm or 2 off on the corner edge of the sump join - but it's getting very close and I wasn't keen on any grinding where the two sumps join.

I bought the starter motor from GBS kitspares. Should I just get the grinder out??

chittyshittybangbang - 10/11/16 at 07:48 PM

I haven't got that far with my build yet but have been doing some research as cutting the sump and fitting the starter is one of the next jobs. This has got some useful information on and does say there is a choice of starter motor sizes. May or may not be related to the problem you have come up against but worth a look.


http://www.toyne.org.uk/zetec-fitment.html

obfripper - 10/11/16 at 09:43 PM

What bellhousing are you using?
IIRC an rs2000 bellhousing has the starter slightly lower and closer to the engine centre line which would make it closer to the sump requiring more to be removed.
I can post a pic of what i had to remove for sump-starter clearance with a sierra type bellhousing if it is useful.

When i installed my zetec originally, i had the lucas starter which wasn't strong enough to start the car when hot - bumpstarting the car on a flat forecourt was not the most gracious of manoeuvers. Rather than spend £250 on a geared powerlite starter, i cut up the donor mondeo starter (1.4kw and geared) and tigged it into the lucas casing for a fraction of the price - has been perfect since.

If this is your starter, it looks fairly similar to my homebrewed starter in size and should not need the flange/sealing edge grinding down to fit.
If you have a lucas type starter it will need a few mm ground away from the flange, but take into account the difficult hot starting!

Dave

chittyshittybangbang - 10/11/16 at 10:28 PM

Sorry not completely related but you may be able to help me? My bell housing appears to be a type where the starter motor can be fitted either side? I am using st170 engine with 1.8 zetec flywheel. Does it matter which side I put the starter? I have the original st170 starter or one that came with a Pinto engine. What is best if any?

chris - 10/11/16 at 11:49 PM

Mine is fitted to the exhaust side you may find that the pinto starter won't do the job ls707r is the starter I used a friend of mine tried using his pinto starter on his zetec and the throw was wrong but he was using the 2ltr zetec fly wheel

obfripper - 11/11/16 at 12:01 AM

quote:
Originally posted by chittyshittybangbang
Sorry not completely related but you may be able to help me? My bell housing appears to be a type where the starter motor can be fitted either side? I am using st170 engine with 1.8 zetec flywheel. Does it matter which side I put the starter? I have the original st170 starter or one that came with a Pinto engine. What is best if any?


You have the rs2000 bellhousing, if you are using a hydraulic csc release bearing you can use either side for the starter motor. With a cable clutch you will need the starter on the passenger side aperture and the clutch cable coming through the drivers side aperture.
I'm not too sure if the sump clearance is much different on either side, but the chassis layout of your car may only allow starter fitment on the passenger side anyway.
The st170 starter will not fit at all (unless you do the above cut&shut mod), the pinto starter would need a 14mm spacer to bring the pinion to the correct engaged position which may cause clearance issues if you're using a modified blacktop/st170 sump.
The kitspares starter is a clone of a valeo vs266, and valeo only make a vs207 now which is a reconditioned lucas lrs707 which is about 15mm wider at the motor casing.
This should be the same starter as the kitspares one.

Dave

obfripper - 11/11/16 at 12:23 AM

Blacktop sump trimmed for starter
Clearance to modded starter
Donor and modded starter

when i had the original lucas starter fitted, i had about 4mm of the flange edge ground off for clearance, i remade the upper section of sump while fitting a new short block a couple years ago and removed the minimum possible for clearance to the modded starter.

Dave

chittyshittybangbang - 11/11/16 at 06:33 PM

Thank you Dave and Chris for the info, I was going to fit an external slave cylinder but will fit a internal one if I find starter needs to be on the inlet side for whatever reason. I am thinking there is normally more space on the exhaust side anyway by the time the steering column is fitted.

emwmarine - 13/11/16 at 07:22 PM

Thanks for the photos folks. The starter now just fits nicely.

However, I have another problem. Just noticed when lifted the engine and gearbox up that though the engine meets the gearbox perfectly at the top at the very bottom it seems to be about 1mm apart. All the bolts are tightly done up and at the side it seems to be touching.

It's a crate engine with factory fitted clutch, i've put in the spigot bearing - and I just can't understand why the engine gearbox wouldn't be touching at the bottom? Even by just 1mm. Any thoughts?

obfripper - 13/11/16 at 08:34 PM

The alloy half of the sump is not doweled, and can move 1-2mm longitudinally when the bolts are in place but not tight.
If yours is on the factory seal with no rtv locking it in place, just slacken the alloy stiffener bolts and slide up to touch.

I tigged a couple lugs onto the stiffener (at bottom of 2nd pic) to meet with the lower bolt holes in the bellhousing, and tapped them m10 for additional support.
When i fitted the sump, i popped a spare bellhousing on and nipped those bolts in place before tightening the sump-block bolts to ensure alignment.

Dave