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how low can you go?
t.j. - 21/5/06 at 06:25 PM

Q.

Made my chassis 360 mm high.
Don't want any bulge on my bonnet.

So i angle my engine......
Does any body see problems with this angle?

BTW any doubts on the engine mounts?
How much can i sjop of the mt75?

grtz
Description
Description





[Edited on 21/5/06 by t.j.]


Liam - 21/5/06 at 06:58 PM

Most locosts I've seen have about 2" of sump sticking out below the bottom rails and have no problem with speed bumps or bottoming out.

LIam


DIY Si - 21/5/06 at 06:58 PM

The engine looks a little low there. You'll want the line roughly level with the bottom of the chassis rails, or you'll forever be bottoming out.
Previous post deleted due to lack of pic.

[Edited on 21/5/06 by DIY Si] Rescued attachment Untitled-1.jpg
Rescued attachment Untitled-1.jpg


givemethebighammer - 21/5/06 at 06:59 PM

Looks like you could shorten the sump to be able to get the engine level.

On another subject, the chassis is just tacked at the moment isn't it ? (sorry, I had to ask)


t.j. - 21/5/06 at 07:05 PM

quote:
Originally posted by givemethebighammer
Looks like you could shorten the sump to be able to get the engine level.

On another subject, the chassis is just tacked at the moment isn't it ? (sorry, I had to ask)


right, only 1/4 is welded. The chassis is still under construction :-)

So 2 " under rails is acceptable? My plan is to short the sump max. so i have to figure out how much bolts i can miss from the mt75 gear-box.
No doubts about the stress by the engine on the two triangles?

[Edited on 21/5/06 by t.j.]


givemethebighammer - 21/5/06 at 07:35 PM

You don't need to fix the bottom two bolts on the bellhousing the other four will be fine. Shorten the sump to level with the bottom of the bell housing (not much point going any more than this). Probably worth putting some of the lost capacity back as 'wings' on the side of the sump. Is that a DOHC sierra engine with an alloy sump ? If so will the steel one from something else fit, as it'll be much easier to shorten.


JoelP - 21/5/06 at 07:38 PM

id aim for a single inch below the bottom if possible. With two inches down there you would have to run a 5 or 6 inch ride height. With my latest project, im having it paneled throughout and so the engine wont protrude at all, and i can run 3" of clearance.


givemethebighammer - 21/5/06 at 07:44 PM

wings like this Rescued attachment sump2.jpg
Rescued attachment sump2.jpg


t.j. - 21/5/06 at 07:54 PM

quote:
Originally posted by givemethebighammer
wings like this


Thx, there are 4 bolts which connect the gaerbox to the sump. If i would take a sump from a pinto does it fit? (except the 4 bolts?)


givemethebighammer - 21/5/06 at 08:05 PM

I don't know too much about sierra engines (I have a zetec). But I think the DOHC engine was the same bottom end as the SOHC with a different head ? So the steel sump from one of those should fit. As long as you have four bolts holding the bellhousing to the engine block (top and middle two) I wouldn't worry about fixing it to the sump at all (my zetec is connected to my type 9 like this). I sure a sierra expert will be along to clarify things shortly.


PaulBuz - 21/5/06 at 09:06 PM

DOHC is different fro the Pinto in every way possible.
The only option is to shorten the sump .
I should know ,I had to do it on my build as I too am using this engine Rescued attachment Picture 524.jpg
Rescued attachment Picture 524.jpg


PaulBuz - 21/5/06 at 09:07 PM

modded Rescued attachment Picture 532.jpg
Rescued attachment Picture 532.jpg


andyharding - 21/5/06 at 09:12 PM

I would make your own engine mounts from scratch. They will flex less and will be easier to mount.

These are the best photos I have atm:-

Mounts hown at left and right

Powder Coated Parts
Powder Coated Parts


Just visable in situ using a Land Rover rubber mount

Pre SVA Prep 7
Pre SVA Prep 7


[Edited on 21/5/06 by andyharding]


caber - 22/5/06 at 04:47 AM

The prop shaft should be parallel to the gearbox out put shaft and diff input when car is level. If you angle the gearbox upwards the prop shaft universal joints will be working very hard possibly creating vibration and early demise of the joint.

Best of luck

Caber


NS Dev - 22/5/06 at 07:41 AM

1) 2 inches below chassis is fine, 5 or 6 inch ride height is also fine.

2) Why would you want to run lower than the suspension is designed for!!????

3) The angle looks a bit steep to me re. prop angle and oil surge in the sump.


givemethebighammer - 22/5/06 at 12:29 PM

quote:
Originally posted by PaulBuz
DOHC is different fro the Pinto in every way possible.
The only option is to shorten the sump .
I should know ,I had to do it on my build as I too am using this engine


Sorry my mistake, it's the Cosworth engine that was a basically a pinto bottom end with a different head. So the DOHC engine only ever had an alloy sump ? I seen steel CVH sumps on zetecs is their nothing similar to the DOHC you could do the same with ?

[Edited on 22/5/06 by givemethebighammer]


t.j. - 22/5/06 at 04:49 PM

quote:
Originally posted by NS Dev
1) 2 inches below chassis is fine, 5 or 6 inch ride height is also fine.

2) Why would you want to run lower than the suspension is designed for!!????

3) The angle looks a bit steep to me re. prop angle and oil surge in the sump.


1. my ride height will be about 13,5cm bottom wishbone parallel with surface.

2. I decide where and what

3. ok you have a point here. i'll measure up my angle, make an UJ at the same degr front as rear.

I will let you know the angle........


NS Dev - 22/5/06 at 10:42 PM

fine, no probs, ride height sounds same as mine and I have 2 inches of sump under the chassis.

You deciding what and where is fine as long as you know what you are doing re. roll centres, bearing in mind these are heavily influenced by the angles at the front of the chassis and the lengths of the wishbones.


Peteff - 23/5/06 at 09:49 AM

If you level the engine the back will be lower and the front will be higher giving you more clearance underneath anyway won't it ?


t.j. - 23/5/06 at 06:20 PM

quote:
Originally posted by NS Dev
fine, no probs, ride height sounds same as mine and I have 2 inches of sump under the chassis.

You deciding what and where is fine as long as you know what you are doing re. roll centres, bearing in mind these are heavily influenced by the angles at the front of the chassis and the lengths of the wishbones.


I read a lot and looked around.
My static-rollcentre is about 5 cm at front 9 at rear. bump-steer calculated at zero. caster 5.30' degr.
Only my camber-gain is a little bit low about .3 degr by 1 inch.
As some cars have non and others much more i watch what will happen.

I think that the camber-gain won't be the biggest problem by the low gravity and the low suspension-travel (8 cm).

The Tyre-choice, ET of the wheels will have more affect on the behavior of the car. My choice is 195/50r15 on Et22 or the ones i already have from the donor 185/65r14 Et42.

If it will have it's affect in worst case i could to get less roll by stiffining the suspension or make an anti-roll-bar.

@pete: I have the rear gear-box mounting now level with the down-side of the rail.
As we have in Holland a lot of speedbumps i presumed that it is the best to avoid "sticky" things in the middle of the car.

Grtz





[Edited on 23/5/06 by t.j.]


sebastiaan - 23/5/06 at 06:28 PM

TJ,

Don't worry too much. I've got about 3" of ground clearance under my sump and it's been ok. Just take it nice and slow on our dutch speedbumps.

Cheers from Zoetermeer,

Sebastiaan


t.j. - 1/6/06 at 06:45 PM

I've calculated my angle it is 3,34 degr.
So it is below the accepted 3,5 degr.

The diff. have to be also 3.34 degr angled. Than i hope i won't get any vibrations in the car.

Grtz