just wondering, as per post.

Does 196+ bhp sound a bit optimistic? (it does rev to 9,500)

if only I could justify spending that much... (... and please don't say BEC!)

Without even clicking the link.
190bhp was possible back out of a Clubman's A xflow in the late 80s - early 90s, so another 6 bhp must be possible.

Agra engineering could build you a 190bhp + xflow if you had the money.

It's more than possible, my dad used to have a full race prepared crossflow 1700 that made over 200bhp at the flywheel! The major downside was the octane number required for the fuel!! And the 10 miles per gallon fuel consumption! And the need to strip down and rebuild every few hundred miles.............

^^^ and vvv

[Edited on 30/10/06 by 02GF74]

An engine builder called John Beattie (who had all but 1 or 2 engines on the grid in the final years of 1700 clubmans) got 220bhp out of a 1600 x/flow.

It was running on methanol / nitro methanol mix!

He reckoned the best ones were 185BHP with loads of torque in a nice flat curve.

Hi i know of a few people currently running 205ish bhp. I have no idea what the costs are of the engines as they say that you just stop counting once you get to a certain point .

I have no idea what revs they use or the amount of torque they are producing either.

cheers matt

chap I used to vaguely know ran an ex clubmans all steel crossflow in a mk1 escort rally car.

Somewhere along the line the steel flywheel got swapped for what turned out to be a lightened (dangerously so) cast iron one and he didn't know.

it let go at 9500rpm (rev limiter) and pretty much cut the car in half.......

so on this basis what do we think I can get out of a 1300 with twin 40's and a mild cam? with megajolt too?

I'd hazard a total guess of 100bhp depending on teh cam and setup, though I know a mate who used to run in f1300 and recon'd @ 10,000rpm the 1300xflow makes about 143bhp.

Ned.

I know F1300 specifies engine type etc as did Clubmans, but there are definitely cheaper ways of making power nowadays.

(That's hardly news - I know).

We had our 1760cc XFlow rolling roaded a while back and the mixture was all over thw place but even so posted a respectable 128 at the wheels...approx 147 at the flywheel, if it had held together long enought to get the fuelling fully sorted with a dynojet kit we were hoping for 155-160 at the flywheel. Spec

AX Block with 85mm forged pistons
Bottom end fully dynamically balanced
lightened flywheel
Kent 254 cam
dry sumped
Caterham supersprint head
R1 bike carbs and megajolt.

Mac

BTW the HP figures quoted were from 2 RR sessions over 3 months apart at 2 different RR so they were consistant.

Depends on the engine you start with.... if you're just dropping a mildy hotter cam and twin 40's on an existing engine you might well get 100bhp (true flywheel bhp NOT what you might see on some rolling roads btw) If you're blueprinting the engine, increasing the compression, putting in a high lift cam and a big valve ported head etc etc you might well see 130bhp but you'll probably have spent £2k doing it.........

That's a lot of money to justify when you can get a lot more for similar money with newer engines

For a standard 1300 you're probably unlikely to see any more than mid 80s with twin webbers and a mild cam

[Edited on 30/10/06 by D Beddows]

[Edited on 30/10/06 by D Beddows]

Mass build some seriously good engines, but you certainly pay for the priviledge.

The crossflow is a great little engine in many respects, fairly light, easy and cheap to extract a reasonable bit of power from, but I think it's silly to spend that kind of money to extra big power unless the use of that engine is mandatory in a particular motorport class. A more modern engine (e.g. 16XE) could acheive the same power without being ready to grenade itself.

i think the best power for a 1600cc xflow is around the 130bhp thats what i have +90 1300cc pistons ported big valve head and twin 40s cost around £1000 to do a full rebuild with all new parts (2nd hand twin 40s)should have spent the money on a redtop.
Rescued attachment Copy of DSCF0796.JPG

As others have mentioned, Clubmans 1700 engines can get about 180-190bhp and that's with restricted choke sizes and only revving to about 8.5-9k tops, but you're looking at £7-8k+ for an engine build with all steel internals. The Class D Clubmans run 1300 all steel engines and they put out about 140bhp IIRC.

A couple of years ago a chap in Classic Clubmans was running a 1700 Xflow with a steel crank / rods / pistons from a modern day production engine (I think it might have been a Nissan engine). It doesn't fit into the regs but he had dispensation to develop the engine with the reasoning that the A class engines are very expensive to build and maintain, so if they could find a cheaper alternative to off-the-shelf steel internals that give similar power without changing the engine as a whole, it would be good for the long term future of the class.

Im a bit out of the loop with Clubmans now though so not sure whether it was a success or not.

[Edited on 2/11/06 by ChrisGamlin]

was that micra engine bits or something, i recall the same discussion about nissan steel internals in a crossflow

Good old Nissan Sunny crank - virtually identical to Ford item. Very difficult to find nowadays though.