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Megasquirt and BEC
blue2cv - 23/3/07 at 09:15 PM

Has anyone successfully run a bec on ms?

Blackbird Rush - 23/3/07 at 09:40 PM

It has been done, and i plan to do also.

What engine have you got?

Ash.

trikerneil - 23/3/07 at 10:59 PM

Strangely enough there are a few bike engined bikes out there too.

DarrenW - 23/3/07 at 11:17 PM

quote:
Originally posted by trikerneil
Strangely enough there are a few bike engined bikes out there too.



What are you drinking???? Can i have a pint of it..... a BEB, whod have thought it.

Why dont you ever see a CEB???? Ive seen CET's. And also TEC but never a CEB

coozer - 23/3/07 at 11:29 PM

Whats the point of mega squirt on a bike engine when they already come with injection?

Its only an advantage on a car engine when you want to replace the HUGE inlet and ECU with a smaller better defined setup.

daviep - 24/3/07 at 01:01 AM

quote:

Whats the point of mega squirt on a bike engine when they already come with injection?


1: Most older bikes were not fuel injected as standard

2: It allows fuelling/ ign. to be tailored to suit the different induction and exhaust combinations which a car is fitted with compared to the bike.

Regards Davie

trikerneil - 24/3/07 at 06:02 AM

Hi DarrenW

Just for you - Pinto engined if I remember correctly.







[Edited on 24/3/07 by trikerneil]

JoelP - 24/3/07 at 08:21 AM

but just look at the face his friend is pulling!

TangoMan - 24/3/07 at 08:48 AM

quote:
Originally posted by coozer
Whats the point of mega squirt on a bike engine when they already come with injection?

Its only an advantage on a car engine when you want to replace the HUGE inlet and ECU with a smaller better defined setup.


I can't formulate a response as effusive as CalvinX but the points he makes are valid.

The other obvious benefit is adjustability. As most of the BECs are non standard, and most petrolheads are into performance improvements, the Megasquirt gives the ability to alter sparks and fuel to meet the requirements of any modifications.

I don't agree that biggest is best the TB's but accept that they are not as size critical as carbs because they don't need good air speed to draw up and atomise fuel. If they are too big, low throttle openings become very sensitive, which is why many of the bike TB's have secondary butterflys.

Oh... and did I mention the adjustability!!

smart51 - 24/3/07 at 09:01 AM

quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
Why dont you ever see a CEB????


Dodge made a bike a few years ago with a Viper engine. A whole 8.3l V10 One or two people have made V8 engined bikes but really the engines are too big for the frames.

Blackbird Rush - 24/3/07 at 10:05 AM

quote:
Originally posted by CaLviNx
I'm running fuel only initially and once I have the fuel table spot on, I will change over to fuel & ignition and tune the spark table too.


How are you triggering the ecu for the sparks, are you running the std cdi ignition box alongside the MS ecu? what is linked between the 2, as this is what i hope to do with my carb Blackbird with injected blackbird throttle bodies fitted but with no cam sensor (does the ZZR1100 have a cam sensor?), fuel first then sparks later....

What MS are you running? V3 MS2?

Also are you running an IACV?

Getting bored waiting for Microsquirt, so will probobly plump for V3 MS2.

Ash

MikeRJ - 24/3/07 at 02:20 PM

quote:
Originally posted by CaLviNx
if it was to replace huge inlet tracts, why does the trend be that "you must fit the largest diameter throttle bodies you can find" appear common when to run a system efficiently you don't need huge diameters/sizes to do so ?


Well, it was quite clear to me at least that what coozer was referring to was eliminating the stock inlet manifold and plenum that modern engines come with and which don't tend to fit under a 7 bonnet. The stock ECU is unlikely to work very well with a totally changed induction system e.g. ITB's, so an after market system is used. Not so complicated is it?

stevebubs - 24/3/07 at 03:05 PM

quote:
Originally posted by DarrenW
quote:
Originally posted by trikerneil
Strangely enough there are a few bike engined bikes out there too.



What are you drinking???? Can i have a pint of it..... a BEB, whod have thought it.

Why dont you ever see a CEB???? Ive seen CET's. And also TEC but never a CEB


You do see CEB and TEBs... (assuming T is Truck...)

stevebubs - 24/3/07 at 03:08 PM

quote:
Originally posted by coozer
Whats the point of mega squirt on a bike engine when they already come with injection?

Its only an advantage on a car engine when you want to replace the HUGE inlet and ECU with a smaller better defined setup.



Hm...where do you start...? 5 most obvious reasons are

1) Changing from airbox to foam filters buggers the map up...
2) What if you want to turbo?
3) Maps for the engines are typically "safe" maps so you can't run at the performance limit
4) Because you can
5) Because the manufacturer puts so much anti-theft technology into the loom it becomes prohibitively expensive to overcome.

stevebubs - 24/3/07 at 03:11 PM

Oh...an there are a few BECs out there with MS controlling everything - including a very nice 'busa turbo (hey, Mr Gamlin?)

MikeRJ - 24/3/07 at 05:30 PM

quote:
Originally posted by CaLviNx

No-one but you need to point that out as we already understood that, but what was being pointed out as listed above that many people including you it would appear, don't know/like to admit, that the MS unit and many other after market ECU's were/are not designed for the sole use by the locost/kitcar market, the kit car market is not the centre of the car world where technology development is concerned.


Where the hell have I ever said that? The MS unit was developed by a bunch of guys that were interested in EFi, it was not designed for any particular application.

The particular bit of incoherent rambling I was referring to was

quote:

if it was to replace huge inlet tracts, why does the trend be that "you must fit the largest diameter throttle bodies you can find" appear common when to run a system efficiently you don't need huge diameters/sizes to do so ?


What precisely does the size of the throttle body have to do with getting rid of an oversized, awkwardly shaped plenum and inlet manifold? Moreover, how does this relate to the MS ECU?

blue2cv - 25/3/07 at 08:26 AM

Thanks for input and sorry for starting a hornets nest. Will now be looking for blackbird tb's if they fit straight on my carb engine

Blackbird Rush - 25/3/07 at 10:36 AM

quote:
Originally posted by CaLviNx
I'm running a MS-I v3.0.............I'm running the Original ignition for spark. (original trigger) the bike's spark ecu has the ignition curves worked out pretty well.........It might be better to go MS-I-v3.0 and run MSnS Hi-Res code.
[Edited on 24/3/07 by CaLviNx]


Cheers fella, usefull pointers.

Ash.

Blackbird Rush - 25/3/07 at 10:38 AM

quote:
Originally posted by blue2cv
Thanks for input and sorry for starting a hornets nest. Will now be looking for blackbird tb's if they fit straight on my carb engine


The do fit but the spacing between BB carb & BB FI heads is slightly different, neeless to say som flexi silicone hose reducers used as joiners should take out the variance.

Ash.

blue2cv - 25/3/07 at 08:32 PM

A trivial item compared to all the other hurdles we get over