Liam
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 03:58 PM |
|
|
So it's just one of these stupid elecrolysis kits, only this one has the added bonus of a control for leaning out your engine up to 0% fuel!!
I can just see it now - must save more, must save more, must save more... crap holes in pistons!
What a load of complete bollards. Love the 'testimony' from Mr Osborne...
'from 15mpg to 34mpg on first motorway run, went to london and back at average 70mph costing half the amount i usually put in.'
Ha ha lol - dude your Mondeo will do 34mpg on the motorway at 70 without the crap fitted anyway!
Oooh their forum requires no registration or email addresses - tee hee hee 
|
|
|
|
|
paulf
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 05:01 PM |
|
|
On the web site it states that pure Hydrogen is dangerous due to its explosive nature but the mixture with oxygen produced by them is much safer which
is obviously incorrect.They seem to imply that it works best with diesels and so it may be acting in the same way as propane injection which is proven
technology .
Paul
|
|
|
Ninehigh
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 07:55 PM |
|
|
Where the whole thing falls down is that they figure you can produce the hydrogen on the fly, however Honda used to advertise a home filling system
with their FCX (yet another viable alternative that they have no intention of cashing in on) that means the hydrogen is produced at home using energy
sources like wind and solar. That would work over here because it's gonna be one or the other!
|
|
|
kitcarcollection
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 07:59 PM |
|
|
you all make one big mistake in the judgements. Ofcourse taking the h2 from water costs at least the same energy than can be taken from the h2 but you
dont take all the enery from the h2 in the engine.
The gain in fuel efficiency with these systems comes from the fact that the H2 gas acts like a reformer.
With a 1AMP current on 12 Volts, you get enough h2 and o2 mixture to add to the intake to get 25% better fuel efficiency.
The octane is boosted by this also and the fuel is burned much more efficient. Side effect is much cleaner exhaust gasses, another good thing. Also
better performance and cleaner engine inside and less heath.
A lot of systems on the market are bad, especially the wet ones.
I tried a dry cell system with stainless steel 316L and Titanium plates which give much better h2 production with no loss of energy (heat ) in the
water like in the wet systems on links above here. Also no residu like on normal stainless is the case.
Watch to use a good catalyst, KOH (potassium hydroxide )is the best!
With lambda regulated engines you must be aware that they will use even more fuel with the h2 system. Reason is that because of the so clean exhaust
gasses, the ECU will think your mixture is to lean and will add more fuel instead.
Solution is a DEFIE chip to connect to the Lambda / O2 sensor that will change the voltage to adapt to the ECU so the amount of fuel injected will be
correct. This works perfectly. Different types of these chips are available like the VOLO (google and u find)
A constant current to do the electrolyse also gives worse result than pulsation. This proves to give more h2 with even less energy lost. Also the
amount of cells used in the drysell determines the result.
The system isnt dangerous as there is no storage of h2 gasses. The gas produced is used immediatly through the intake. Dont put it directly into the
manifold by the way but in the air intake. Ofcourse the power should be cut as soon as engine stops to prevent gas production at that moment.
In general you can say, the less efficient your engine, the better results with the H2 system.
But half of the ones on the market are cheap and bad, especially what is linked to here above.
My reason to use "HHO " was to pass the emission tests on a carburettor bike engined kitcar. The gasses are very clean now. Co dropped
from 1% by to below 0,1%. This alone was worth the investment. Now Im gaining 30ct per liter when I use it on my daily driver as well
I made a small study of a lot of systems over a few weeks time. Reality has stopped me from being sceptic although I was also sceptic choosing the
right system.
[Edited on 11/7/11 by kitcarcollection]
[Edited on 11/7/11 by kitcarcollection]
Dutch kitcarcollection.
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 08:59 PM |
|
|
I find it incredibly difficult to believe that 1amp at 12v produces any significant amount of hydrogen, especially compared to the amount of air and
fuel being blown through an engine. Have you actually set it (hydrolysis) up on a table and seen how many bubbles are produced?
|
|
|
Badger_McLetcher
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 10:04 PM |
|
|
No.... Just no.
To elaborate slightly: No.
To put it slightly differently: Nein.
With a French twist: Non.
Look at it this way: if it worked manufacturers would be using the system on their cars and rejoicing at the sudden reduction on R&D spending
they would have to undertake to meet emissions requirements.
So finally... Negative.
That is all 
If disfunction is a function, then I must be some kind of genius.
|
|
|
Ninehigh
|
| posted on 11/7/11 at 10:58 PM |
|
|
Yeah because car manufacturers give that much of a s**t they're rushing to get those electric vehicles out...
Oh wait a minute, they've been two years away since 1996
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 12/7/11 at 06:14 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ninehigh
Yeah because car manufacturers give that much of a s**t they're rushing to get those electric vehicles out...
Oh wait a minute, they've been two years away since 1996
Think about it; of course the manufacturers want to produce an economical car, as mpg is a major sellign point. Imagine if you could sell it as
100mpg. It would go like hot cakes! The fact is, whilst there is room to improve the efficiency of an engine, a few bubbles of hydrogen arent going to
half fuel usage.
|
|
|
Liam
|
| posted on 12/7/11 at 06:21 AM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Ninehigh
Yeah because car manufacturers give that much of a s**t they're rushing to get those electric vehicles out...
Oh wait a minute, they've been two years away since 1996
It's not so much the emissions - it's the efficiency. Fuel economy is pretty much the number one selling point these days on a lot of
cars, and the manufacturers are pumping billions into R&D - if a few quid worth of tat magically gained 25-50% in fuel economy it'd be
fitted to every model.
edit: not fast enough at stating the obvious 
[Edited on 12/7/11 by Liam]
|
|
|
kitcarcollection
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 05:36 PM |
|
|
its the standard reactions you get from the physicians and disbelievers who all have never heard about improvement of combustion with this additive.
It works folks, believe me, I tested it and not only got my emission way down to 0,1% co without a cat but also improved milage of 20-30%.
Its a simple fact that there is soo much disbelieve and rubbish on the market. Take a dry sell system on stainless 316L or titanium plates on 12AMP ,
lambda extender and youre ready to earn. Around 400dollar buys you all you need.
Ofcourse the authorities will not be happy, all money earned comes from oil..... Look what they did to stan meyer and many others....
Dutch kitcarcollection.
|
|
|
Ninehigh
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 06:06 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
quote:
Originally posted by Ninehigh
Yeah because car manufacturers give that much of a s**t they're rushing to get those electric vehicles out...
Oh wait a minute, they've been two years away since 1996
Think about it; of course the manufacturers want to produce an economical car, as mpg is a major sellign point. Imagine if you could sell it as
100mpg. It would go like hot cakes! The fact is, whilst there is room to improve the efficiency of an engine, a few bubbles of hydrogen arent going to
half fuel usage.
Ok then what about an engine that uses no
fuel at all
ever
Just three sets of vehicles there from three manufacturers that I've been pestering to sell me one. The answers I've had are
"available 2012" "never heard of it" and "have a look at the website" respectively.
On the other hand Nissan were rather keen to sell me the Leaf, but pointed out that I wouldn't be able to drive it home without charging it
halfway back... (range of 75 miles, nearest dealer about 75 miles away)
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 07:06 PM |
|
|
nothing special there, just fuel cell cars. Not even a new idea now. Why arent they available? Well, i suppose its partly that, as you say, there
arent enough stockists of hydrogen (much like lpg round here), and the national grid couldnt cope if we all tried to fill them up at home.
We need cheap clean power supplies first, like lots more nuclear. 
IMHO, we're barking up the wrong tree to a certain extent. The fact is, that having everyone driving around in one or two tonnes of metal,
starting and stopping all the time, is simply too uneconomical in the first place. We are approaching a plateau where there isnt much more economy to
realistically get out of modern engines. The solution to me is computer control. All vehicles controlled by a network of computers, vehicles going the
same way would be grouped together and slipstreaming each other, no stopping for lights because they are organised into packets on the approach to a
junction and no one slows down at all. Plus, much higher speed limits. And if you think it would be too dangerous, well, 3000 people die every year on
the roads anyway. Id say put it on rails too but that would probably cost far too much to set up.
|
|
|
Doctor Derek Doctors
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 08:37 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by kitcarcollection
Ofcourse the authorities will not be happy, all money earned comes from oil..... Look what they did to stan meyer and many others....
Funniest thing I have ever read!
Designer and Supplier of the T89 Designs - Single Seater Locost. Build you own Single Seater Racecar for ~£5k.
Plans and Drawings available, U2U or e-mail for details.
Available Now: The Sports Racer Add-On pack, Build a full bodied Sports Racer for Trackdays, Sprints and Racing.
www.t89.co.uk
www.racecarwings.co.uk
callan@t89.co.uk
|
NOTE:This user is registered as a LocostBuilders trader and may offer commercial services to other users
|
Ninehigh
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 09:21 PM |
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
nothing special there, just fuel cell cars. Not even a new idea now. Why arent they available? Well, i suppose its partly that, as you say, there
arent enough stockists of hydrogen (much like lpg round here), and the national grid couldnt cope if we all tried to fill them up at home.
Doesn't stop the fact that some people are screaming for a cheaper alternative. Heck I'd buy a car that ran on Coca Cola (and none of the
cheaper ones) if I could get 50mpg... Look in the right places and it's cheaper than diesel and the missus wouldn't have to consider
looking for another job because it's becoming too expensive.
Just like we have people that refuse to have diesel (for all those stereotypes from the 70s and 80s) there will be people that refuse to buy an
electric car. Let them. My wallet aches to be able to fill a car for less than £70 (I nearly poo'd when I put £50 in a 106 BY ACCIDENT, and it
still wasn't full!)
|
|
|
JoelP
|
| posted on 13/7/11 at 10:05 PM |
|
|
i feel your pain, ive had £110 in the van in the past.
Since moben went bust ive got a new contract with a local firm, and i leave home 5 mins before i need to arrive now, and ive only done 30 miles all
week Compare that to fits as far as stranraer and kelso
|
|
|
.jpg)
