Northy
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| posted on 26/10/03 at 09:17 PM |
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I'll have a look and see what we've got at work. But it is possible to get programmers that program lots of different chips.
Cheers
Graham
Website under construction. Help greatfully received as I don't really know what I'm doing! 
"If a man says something in the woods and there are no women there, is he still wrong?"
Built 2L 8 Valve Vx Powered Avon
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sgraber
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| posted on 26/10/03 at 10:51 PM |
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Regarding the ignition - MJLJ (by Picasso) - I had a short email conversation with him regarding the MegaJoltLiteJunior and he is apparently willing
and able to help people out. He has a definite interest in Locost related builds, especially mid-engine! hehe 
Drop him an email and see what you can find out! He has one running on a 4AGE already....
I have decided to build the MegaSquirt and the MJLJ so that I can run the little turbo setup that I just bought  . Just biding my time now...
Graber
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 09:04 AM |
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I didn't email him as I took for granted the blurb on the website that stated that
they would be making stuff available later.
I didn't want to disturb him.
The Willette programmer page also states that they have stopped the group buys for the time being and will resume later.
This is all very frustrating when you have all the details but unable to continue.
Bear in mind that in the UK some of the bits are unobtainable at a reasonable cost off the shelf.
This makes ordering from States the only way to go.
I've had mixed success this way. Some bits I've ordered have arrived within a few days, others took weeks to arrive. I'm talking in
general here, not specifically about the MegaS stuff.
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 10:31 AM |
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Right, I did some more exploring.
I was wrong when I stated that the programmer chips were not available. It doesn't use one !!
In my hasty examination of the schematic i saw the processor in circuit and assumed it was a progged chip for the programmer.
I now have the programmer PCB layout, it's another single sided, easy to make board.
Just to recap, at the moment there is no programmed chip available for the MJolt lite BUT the code is there. So prog a chip and it's away, hence
my searching.
Once I've built this programmer I will be able to program many chips should anyone in UK require one and it doesn't step on anyones
toes.
Next job is PCB making. For just the two I'll forego the photo etching and do manual boards.
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sgraber
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 03:06 PM |
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Rob,
I hope that you can keep a detailed web diary of your progress (and the process of finding parts, building boards...) with lots of pictures and
explanation for those of us less "grey matter endowed" individuals!
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 06:18 PM |
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I'll try to keep things posted as I progress.
I've discovered that the PCB layout for the Megaprog is mirror image for photo etching.
Unfortunately the layout is in the pdf doc and when you extract it as an image, the resolution is so low that the tracks merge.
I may email the author and ask for a direct copy from which to print.
I've sourced all bar one component in the UK and that's the MAP sensor. It's available from Stateside for 19 dollars, if I
don't find a supplier in UK then I'll send for a couple.
So. I have PCB layout for MegaJ lite, PCB layout for programmer, order placed for a partial Megasquirt kit, sourced rest of components from Farnell
in UK and a local shop.
If anyones interested in UK then I'll post Farnells order codes and buying list for MJ lite.
Rob Lane
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Northy
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 06:26 PM |
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Go on the Rob
Rob, with your new found knowledge, would you know if I could do away with the MAP sensor for a carb system? Would I be able to use a throttle
position sensor instead as the Alpha kit does?
Where are you documenting all this? A web site?
Cheers
Graham
Website under construction. Help greatfully received as I don't really know what I'm doing!
"If a man says something in the woods and there are no women there, is he still wrong?"
Built 2L 8 Valve Vx Powered Avon
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JoelP
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 07:30 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Rob Lane
I've sourced all bar one component in the UK and that's the MAP sensor.
Rob Lane
Does it have to be a specific MAP sensor? my rover use to have one, so maybe use second hand? or would it need calibrating?
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 09:15 PM |
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I've sourced a supply of MAP sensors in UK,
but the cost 28 pounds each!!!!!
Yes, the Megasquirt (MS) calls for a specific sensor as does the MegaJolt Lite (MJL).
It's a Motorola MPX4250 which according to datasheet is .2v to 4.9v output for 2.9psi to 33psi.
I could wire in the Toyota MAP sensor I have at the moment but I haven't looked up its characteristics. It would be too much effort to re-write
the value change into the software.
I'm doing all this because most of the hard work has been done by Bowling and Grippo, with all thanks given to them for their generosity.
I originally started a project like this a couple of years ago but the effort put into it is very high. I also was using a PIC controller but
it's not capable of keeping up with ignition speed event requirements.
There is a TP mentioned but I've yet to find the details.
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Metal Hippy
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| posted on 27/10/03 at 09:29 PM |
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Something like this is a long way off, but I keep thinking of something like this and associated throttle bodies for the Beemer....
I know I'm getting ahead of myself in relation to where my project is at, but what the hell...
Cock off or cock on. You choose.
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garage19
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| posted on 29/10/03 at 08:28 AM |
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"Once I've built this programmer I will be able to program many chips should anyone in UK require one and it doesn't step on anyones
toes.
Next job is PCB making. For just the two I'll forego the photo etching and do manual boards."
How many boards do you need to make to make photo etching economicable?
I for one will put my name down for a programmed chip and PCB if you can supply?
Thanks,
Doug.
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 29/10/03 at 07:23 PM |
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Photo etching needs about 20 boards to be useful.
I don't want to get snowed under but i should be able to do one other board manually. They are some way off yet as i don't have enough
etch resist transfers left!
Chip is a bit harder to source. Farnells are on 20 week forward order on them but there are other suppliers when I get round to them.
I obtained all the other components for my build today, some from Bardwells at Sheffield and others from Farnells in Leeds.
It is possible to get everything from Farnells, I have some of the important order codes noted if interested.
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Northy
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| posted on 29/10/03 at 07:45 PM |
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Rob, I was just about to post to see how you've been getting on
I'll email you.
Cheers
Graham
Website under construction. Help greatfully received as I don't really know what I'm doing!
"If a man says something in the woods and there are no women there, is he still wrong?"
Built 2L 8 Valve Vx Powered Avon
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CairB
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| posted on 29/10/03 at 07:57 PM |
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Rob,
Have you tried Press-n-Peel for PCB masking. You print the tracks on a special film on a laser printer / photo copier then iron onto the copper clad
board which transfers the print onto the board. I've used it sucessfully for a couple of 8051 based projects, and a programmer.
See:
Press-n-Peel
Good luck with the project, sounds like you will end up with the kit list for this side of the pond.
Cheers,
Colin
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 30/10/03 at 08:51 AM |
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Thanks, that looks excellent for a few boards.
Trouble is with the projects, that the PCB layouts provided on the sites are on the poor side for quality. That's why i was doing a manual
board. I think they are that way to encourage you to buy a pre-made board.
I've ordered one of the starter kits as it's such good value. I've spent about 80 pounds so far and have everything accounted for
bar the EDIS system from a Frod.
Also, for the programmer I was modifying the tracks to provide a cable header output, as I have a 40 pin ZIF socket for my PIC programmer that plugs
in to a mini header. Saves 12 pounds or so on another socket!
Anyone read the Mega Manual and looked at the animated MegaTune display? It looks really good, with on the fly reprogramming of the fuelling. I
believe there's also one called MegaTune-SS for the ignition advance.
I have seen a guy at one of the competition road going sprints loading a new map for his engine that produced about 15bhp more BUT only for a very
short duration else engine damage! He reloaded the road map to drive home.
The engine was a Vauxhall XE twin cam. I would assume he was loading a very large ignition advance to suit his cams.
Secretive lot, they won't divulge much.
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CairB
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| posted on 30/10/03 at 09:03 AM |
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Rob,
Don't let me send you off track
For boards I've been using the demo version of PCB Elegance. It takes a bit of getting used to as with most but is useful for tweaks. Requires
the design to start with the schematic, so may not help much with this project.
Download - PCB Elegance
Cheers,
Colin
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 31/10/03 at 01:12 AM |
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I've now managed to clean up the MJLJ pcb layout. It originally had component overlays and was multi-coloured.
Hopefully it's below this.
 
Rescued attachment mjlj_brd pcbtrack.png
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sgraber
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| posted on 31/10/03 at 03:06 AM |
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Nicely done. I will certainly use that! I took the liberty of creating another image that might be helpful. The parts layout for the top of the board.
Please note that this image is mirrored from Rob's image. In fact Rob's image probably needs to be mirrored before printing if you are going
to use it with iron on transfers. (I think that's right.
 
MJLJ PCB Parts Layout
You all are aware that this Ignition board can be run independently of Mega Squirt Fuel Computer. This means that you can use MJLJ(EDIS) standalone to
control your ignition sans distributor, with carbies.
Later,
Graber
PS - Here's the circuit side mirrored.
 
MJLJ PCB Circuit Lines -Mirrored
These images are in my locostbuilders album.
[Edited on 10/31/03 by sgraber]
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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eddymcclements
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| posted on 31/10/03 at 03:53 PM |
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Rob,
A very good friend of mine travels back and forth from the States on a regular basis, usually with a load of electronic components in his luggage -
he's designing & building an interface for a body scanner which can be run from a PC instead of a dedicated system costing hundreds of
thousands of pounds. He has brought ICs back for me which are readily available and cheaper in the US, so if there's anything you require, let
me know. He also has PCBs made in small numbers while prototyping the latest version of his controller card, and could easily get a small run of
MegaJoltLiteJr boards made.
Needless to say, a Megasquirt and MegaJolt are on my plan for next year along with my no. 2 engine re-built with cams, higher-compression pistons,
headworks etc. (need to get the car running in v1.0 mode first).
Cheers,
Eddy
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 2/11/03 at 04:02 PM |
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Eddy,
I'll be in touch by email.
Meanwhile, one handmade Willette Programmer board etched ready for drilling.
Reason for this board is to program the KX8 processor chip for the MJLJ and program a GP32 chip for MSnEDIS.
As I understand it at the moment, MSnEDIS only requires two small component changes to workan EDIS direct. The changes to MegaSquirt have been
achieved in software to drive the EDIS module. This will save me making a MJLJ seperately.
[Edited on 2/11/03 by Rob Lane]
[Edited on 2/11/03 by Rob Lane]
 
Rescued attachment WillettePCB.jpg
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Spyderman
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| posted on 2/11/03 at 04:05 PM |
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Chris,
I think you need to check the host computer clock.
[Edited on 2/11/03 by Spyderman]
Spyderman
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sgraber
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| posted on 2/11/03 at 04:38 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Rob Lane
As I understand it at the moment, MSnEDIS only requires two small component changes to workan EDIS direct. The changes to MegaSquirt have been
achieved in software to drive the EDIS module. This will save me making a MJLJ seperately.
Rob, Wow there sure a a lot of different flavors of this machine!
Thanks for posting your MSnEDIS findings.
Having a standalone EDIS ignition computer like MJLJ is a great thing for converting 4AGE to carbs. But using one board to control both fuel and
ignition makes much more sense than piggybacking the ignition board.
Here's the link to MSnEDIS information page : http://www.jsm-net.demon.co.uk/megasquirtnedis/
Steve
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 2/11/03 at 05:39 PM |
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It's not just the 4AGE of course. It would suit the Zetec as well.
If you have an early Zetec it should have come with an EDIS module, so a MegaSquirtnEDIS is ideal to tune it. Especially if the manifold has been
shortened.
I've posted on both MS lists the Bill of Materials with Farnell UK order codes in text format. I will add to files on here if I can.
They will supply anyone and offer 24 hour order line with orders before 7pm on next day delivery.
Order line tel number 0870 1200 200
www.farnell.com/uk
I have their 6 catalogue set for ordering. Nearly broke postmans back!!
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Rob Lane
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| posted on 2/11/03 at 05:44 PM |
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Hmm, can't find a files area, only photos.
Lets see if it attaches OK.
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sgraber
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| posted on 3/11/03 at 05:35 PM |
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I guess I'll keep this thread alive with some more info.
You can buy a pre-made MSquirt and other pre-made boards from here: He will ship overseas
http://home.earthlink.net/~jcgebhart/preasmms.txt
This page -http://home.earthlink.net/~jcgebhart/msindex.html- is possibly the clearest MegaSquirt information compilation I have found.
It's a keeper, so I figured I would post it here for posterity!
Later,
Graber
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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