Neil P
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| posted on 22/7/09 at 06:49 PM |
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4age engine swap
Having killed my engine I need to get something to replace it.
The easiest way will be to put another 16v in it (anyone got one?) and this will probably be the way I will go, just so I can get it on the road.
However, does anyone have info on how much work is involved in putting in a 20v instead? It may be an opportunity to change it now it has been
SVA'd.
Does the 20v use the same bellhousing bolt pattern etc?
Neil
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oldtimer
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| posted on 22/7/09 at 06:55 PM |
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I believe it does, the exhaust manifold is very similar but not a direct swap - the lugs for the studs are a little different.
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tonym
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| posted on 22/7/09 at 07:49 PM |
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Belhousing is the same as are engine mounts. The two end lugs on the exhaust manifold need cutting off and welding in a new location. You will need a
trigger wheel and an ecu capable of ignition, fueling and controlling the variable cam timing and a blanking plate (core plug) for the hole left by
the distributor.
The cooling system outlets are also different.
It think that is all.
Hope this helps
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rick q
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| posted on 22/7/09 at 11:38 PM |
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Tonym has got it covered.
I swapped my 16V for a 20V last year - brilliant little engine. The sumps are similar but not interchangable. Cooling system is radically different.
It would be simplest to find a 20V with matching loom and 'puter - though I run a Haltech.
16V exhaust can be re-used though you can just slot the first and last stud holes.
Happy to send pictures if that's any help.
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bimbleuk
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| posted on 23/7/09 at 11:28 AM |
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I thought I only had to modify one of the exhaust flange holes. Only different at one end where the oil solenoid sticks out of the 20V head.
As above the mounting and bell housing locations are similar.
The water routing is different but the 20V design is very simple as it all comes off the back of the head. Much tidier than the 16V.
The sump on the 20V has an indentation on one side for 3 of the bolts where the 16V is straight. I think its possible to swap between them with some
modification. I had a cast alloy baffled sump not long a go which would work on both derivatives. The flange was just very wide where the blocks
differed and you drilled holes appropriately.
Essentially it will bolt in place of the 16V then you'll have lots of little details to keep you busy in the evenings.
I started with a 16V to pass the SVA (no CAT) and quickly replaced it with the 20V. I can't remember any major issues and re-used the same
exhaust manifold, mounts, gearbox housing, clutch etc.
The VVT isn't that complicated and actually just needs a 12V trigger to actuate at a set RPM as its either on or off.
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Neil P
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| posted on 23/7/09 at 09:10 PM |
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Cheers guys,
may be something for later, then. I really want to get it running and on the road. Is the 20V worthwhile for the extra performance? It didn't
feel particularly quick with the 16V (although it was wet and probably wasn't gripping particularly well).
Neil
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rick q
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| posted on 24/7/09 at 12:08 AM |
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There are two different 20V's - the older Silvertop and the newer Blacktop (colour refers to the cam cover).
Blacktops put out more power at higher rpm but have lighter internals. Silvertops are internally the same as the 16V (read - strong).
Lots of good info here :- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/8422/4age.htm and here :- http://www.billzilla.org/4agstock.htm
It seems if you're chasing maximum power (e.g. Formula Atlantic), you stick with the 16V because the 3 inlet valves on the 20's make it
hard to get inlet resonance right on the money.
I'm really chuffed with mine though.
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bimbleuk
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| posted on 24/7/09 at 10:32 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Neil P
Cheers guys,
may be something for later, then. I really want to get it running and on the road. Is the 20V worthwhile for the extra performance? It didn't
feel particularly quick with the 16V (although it was wet and probably wasn't gripping particularly well).
Neil
If you're after a bolt in engine to get a genuine upgrade from a 16V then yes the blacktop 20V is worth the expense. The engine just feels so
much more lively due to the lighter iternals, lighter flywheel (not all come with them attached and throttle bodies. You should get at least 150BHP
from a blacktop which is 30BHP more than a late 16V engine.
As mentioned if you are after 180BHP from one without forced induction then stick to the 16V.
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bimbleuk
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| posted on 24/7/09 at 10:43 AM |
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They make for a tidier install compared to a 16V in my opinion. You can see below all the plumbing comes off the back of the head. and runs down the
side of the engine bay. The head and cam cover are tidier too especially in a nice bright glossy paint finish unlike mine!
You can also see where at the left end of the exhaust manifold there is an oil solenoid where the 16V usually just has a stud.
 
Original engine bay layout - side
[Edited on 24-7-09 by bimbleuk]
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Neil P
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| posted on 26/7/09 at 01:07 PM |
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Thanks for the info.
I think I'll replace it like for like for now and take my time in keeping an eye out for a decent 20v upgrade over the next year or so.
Cheers
Neil
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blockhead_rich
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| posted on 29/7/09 at 11:15 PM |
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I want to up-grade mine now! So I have for sale two 16v 4age engines (one running and one spare) the runner has GSXR T/B's and larger
injectors. It made 151bhp @ 7400 rpm ~ 117mph on the R/road.
Wanted, Silvertop or blacktop engine.
Rich
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blockhead_rich
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| posted on 10/8/09 at 09:55 PM |
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Is anyone interested in Silver or Blacktop 4age engines imported from the far east. I'm looking at importing some ~ Silver top cost would be
circa £550 landed in the UK? Would come with all ancillaries + engine wiring and toyota ECU (less flywheel). U2U me if your are. Lead-time approx 6
weeks or so.
Regards
Rich
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