daveb666
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| posted on 20/1/14 at 10:50 AM |
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Zetec Silvertop Oil Recommendations
My last oil change was using 5/30 comma x-tech but after yesterday's trackday the oil had got a bit hot so the engine was tappier at the end of
the day than the start which obviously isn't ideal.
What oil do people run in their zetecs, ideally those that participate in a lot of track action?
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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mcerd1
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| posted on 20/1/14 at 11:02 AM |
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mine was a blacktop in the focus tin-top - but I revved the t**s off it on a daily basis so probably not far off track day use...
(why use 5th gear when 2nd will do - it only gets fun above 4k rpm anyway  )
I always just ran with 5w30 A1 castrol magnatec (the stuff that says for fords on it) and never had any issues - you can sometimes get it quite cheap
in the supermarkets too 
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Charlie_Zetec
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| posted on 20/1/14 at 11:36 AM |
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I've chosen Motul 5-30 fully synthetic, after using the same weight semi-synth to bed the new engine/components in.
If trackdays are having that sort of effect, have you also considered the next step of fitting an oil cooler? Either similar style to early Vauxhalls
with a "winged" area around pipework in front of the rad (only a small effect), or a proper oil cooler with a thermostatic control valve?
I've gone for the latter approach, but yet to try it out so can't offer much feedback on that yet!
Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity!
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daveb666
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| posted on 20/1/14 at 12:01 PM |
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I think I'll go for an oil change rather than looking at oil coolers just yet. I used to have a GTE 16v with an XE that had an oil cooler, until
I burst one of the pipes. I chose to remove the oil cooler (cheaper!) and did another 2 or 3 trackdays with out and never suffered any ill-effects.
I'll really struggle to fit an oil cooler as I don't have the room to fit a sandwich plate prior to the oil filter, due to its location in
relation to the steering column - I'd therefore have to start messing about with remote filters etc!
You're probably right in that it's either poor oil or the oil got too hot. The cheapest option is to put in some better oil and get a oil
temperature gauge 
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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Scuzzle
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| posted on 20/1/14 at 12:43 PM |
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Fords own Formula F zetec oil is Castrol 5w30 Ford spec Magnatec so I use either of these based on whatever I can get cheapest at the time.
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lordbenny
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 12:00 PM |
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This is what I use:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Genuine-Ford-Fully-Synthetic-5W30-Engine-Oil-5-litres-Formula-F-1502266-/331027139775?pt=UK_Vehicle_Oils_Lubricants_Flui
ds&hash=item4d12c14cbf
[Edited on 23/1/14 by lordbenny]
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daveb666
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 03:09 PM |
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Scuzzle/Lord Benny - have either of you done track days with the oils that you've recommended?
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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lordbenny
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 03:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by daveb666
Scuzzle/Lord Benny - have either of you done track days with the oils that you've recommended?
Don't really see the relevance, it's the recommended oil, whether your on track or the road doesn't make any difference IMO.
I would suggest that the things you have to consider when pushing hard on track lies with other things like oil starvation, cooling, engine breathing,
oil loss.
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daveb666
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 03:38 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by lordbenny
quote:
Originally posted by daveb666
Scuzzle/Lord Benny - have either of you done track days with the oils that you've recommended?
Don't really see the relevance, it's the recommended oil, whether your on track or the road doesn't make any difference IMO.
I would suggest that the things you have to consider when pushing hard on track lies with other things like oil starvation, cooling, engine breathing,
oil loss.
So you're saying that "the recommended oil" by Ford is considered suitable for track-use? - I don't.
If this was the case why would oil manufacturers produce oil that are, specifically for racing/track-us, because engines on a track take more abuse
than they ever would on the road and therefore are subjected to higher stresses and operating temperatures.
I'm amazed you think that the "recommended oil" from Ford will also be the "recommended oil" for using the cars on
track.
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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lordbenny
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 04:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by daveb666
I'm amazed you think that the "recommended oil" from Ford will also be the "recommended oil" for using the cars on
track.
Well I'm glad I amazed you
Go ahead and buy some £25 a litre racing oil if you want to, however, I'd suggest your blow your money on other things!
The recommended road oil (a good brand & fully synthetic helps) will be fine for track days, you might want to change it a bit more regularly if
you're on track a lot but dont be fooled that you need sooper dooper race oil.
[Edited on 23/1/14 by lordbenny]
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mcerd1
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 04:32 PM |
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I think the key here is - 'have you modified the engine significantly ? '
if you've not then the standard oil is probably still fine - its not like your entering Le Mans with it
also these days road car oils are generally quite good quality as the car makers (encouraged by governments) are all pushing for longer and longer
service intervals - so the oil has to get better....
even the 'for fords' castrol magnatec stuff changed a few years back to a 'fully synthetic' formulation to suit the newer ford
cars (that why it now covers the ford 913-C spec as well as the older A and B ones)
everyone used to run tuned up pinto's on 20w50 or 20w60 oils - but these days I'm told you want to run it on a decent modern 10w40 or
15w40 (same as ford recommend) - some people even get away with thinner oils than that!
but then pinto's are hapy with all kinds of oil anyway....
but zetec's are known to be fussy about the oil they use, I was always told the wrong stuff will make the cam followers 'sticky' and
make it sound tappety - the magnatec / ford oils work so I'd stick to them unless you are having other issues (like say burning too much oil
or the pressure dropping too much when its hot)
[Edited on 24/1/2014 by mcerd1]
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britishtrident
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 04:37 PM |
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In the stoneage when all you could buy was mineral oil,the brand of product made a big difference this was because mineral oil is highly dependant on
the quality of feed stock and a complex blend additives to achieve the desire viscosity and performance characteristics. Oil distilled from some
crude oil feed stocks especially those from the US required less additives than others this is why US lubricant manufacturers had a early lead in
producing higher performance multigrade oils.
The situation is a bit different with fully synthetic oils, even the cheapest supermarket fully synthetic will out perform the best mineral oil.
The properties of synthetic oil depend almost entirely on the base stock, unlike mineral oils which depend on addditives the properties of synthetic
oils don't deteriorate much when when churned through a very hot engine for tens of thousands of miles.
Synthetic engine oils come from 2 main familys of feed stock, the cheaper ones are made from cracked long chain hydrocarbons the very expensive ones
are ester based.
As far as I know even the most expensive engines oils sold in the UK are not made from 100% ester feed stock.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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daveb666
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| posted on 23/1/14 at 05:02 PM |
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@britishtrident - the engine is on throttle bodies, runs about 170bhp and revs to 7,500rpm so it is working harder than stock.
On the trackday I did last week the engine didn't use a single bit of oil, but sounded a bit 'tappy' after each session - therefore
I'm assuming that the oil had got hotter than was preferable.
I don't have an oil temperature gauge, or oil cooler - it may be beneficial to fit one but I'm tight for space, so in order to fit a
cooler I'd need to fit an oil filter relocation kit which increases costs.
Therefore, my thoughts were that if I can find an oil that is better suited to a track environment, this may be slightly more expensive in the
short-term, but will ultimately save me having to install a gauge/cooler/relocation kit etc.
I hope that explains the background abit more to my question.
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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britishtrident
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| posted on 24/1/14 at 12:57 PM |
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You might want to consider trying to reduce the under bonnet temperature by cutting vents i the side panels, this should reduce the sump
temperature.
There are a lot of good fully synthetic 5w/40 oils out there the specifications are very similar Mobile 1, and Shell Helix Ultra are considered the
best but Comma Ultralite 5w/40 matches the performance of these very closely and what data I can find on supermarket 5w/40 synthetics shows very
similar performance, these days since cheap[ supplies of Havoline 5w/530 and 5w/40 Longlife have disappeared from the UK market I have switched to
ASDA for oil.
If you look around on ebay you should find a selection 5w/50 oils the Comma Motorsport 5w/50 actually has better viscosity characteristics than
Castrol Edge 5w/50 but I would regard these as oil for summer use.
This data I collected a few months back might help
[Edited on 24/1/14 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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Paul Turner
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| posted on 24/1/14 at 04:02 PM |
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Originally in my Silvertops I always ran the Ford recommended A1/ 5w/30 oil. Originally it was semi-synthetic but when I did some trackdays I used the
Opie recommended Motul 300V ester synthetic 5w/30 which will withstand much higher temps before it goes out of grade, never had a rattly tappet when I
used it.
Now Blacktop fitted and I only use the car on the road I simply use 5w/30 fully synthetic A5 spec, currently its Motul 8100 eco-nergy simply because
Opie had an offer on it, before that it was Mobil 1, next time I buy some who knows what brand it will be.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 24/1/14 at 04:39 PM |
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Any fully synthetic will take very very high temperatures before the viscosity characteristics change.
The real advantage of ester based based synthetic is at the pour point at the extreme cold end of the scale.
The pour point can be thought of as the lowest temperate at which the oil will pour out the can, which is an indication of the lowest temperature at
which you could expect the oil to be pumped through the system.
If you live in Finland or Alaska putting an ester based synthetics in your engine is a pretty good investment.
Mineral oil generally have a pour point of about -25c.
Semi-synthetics -25 to -33
Cracked based stock synthetics generally have a pour point of -30 to -36
Ester based synthetics the pour point is from -40 to -60
However all oils are blended so the divisions between them are not as distinct as the would appear , a mineral oil may contain some synthetic, a
cracked base stock synthetic may contain some mineral oil and/or some ester synthetic and an ester based oil may contain some of the cheaper feed
stocks.
I have been told the most expensive oils generally only contain 90% ester feed stock.
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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daveb666
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| posted on 24/1/14 at 05:21 PM |
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@britishtrident - I really appreciate your help and contribution to this thread; hopefully it will assist others in future deciding the oil.
The comma xtec 5/30 I used previously (recommended for Zetecs) obviously wasn't that great at withstanding high temperatures. As I do drive hard
on the road (as well as the track) I'm going to try a 5/40 comma next - if that doesn't work then I will look at a more expensive 5/30.
The comma oils are a great price at my local factors so if I can stick with one of those that would be my preference.
2007bc Photography - Commercial and Wedding Photographer based in West Yorkshire
http://www.2007bc.co.uk / http://www.huddersfieldcommercialphotographer.co.uk
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