Hi

i have my IVA next week and done an emissions check on a sun gas analyser and with the CAT hot is well under the limit..

took it my local MOT centre earlier and there emissions machine is different to the Sun one but goverment approved..

my Co is 0.05 and hhc is 93 which is the same on both machines but the MOT one shows my lambda reading and that's well high..

can anyone advise on how i can get this down?

thanks in advance.

i think you must have additional air getting into your exhaust (not from the engine)

See this http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h56.pdf

If you can't find an exhaust leak, you have some headway on emissions, you could try richening the mixture very slightly.

Playing with the fuelling may well be the only answer here (as long as there's nothing else obviously contributing). I'm very impressed with the figures though, given that this is an old K2 without an ECU lambda feedback loop.

The Suzuki mapped fuel mixture at the low end of things on the bike is a compromise between emmissions and noise, even on the old K2.

Other workarounds include backing off the fuel pressure..... something (along with a dual catalyst can bodge) that I perform once a year. The car won't drive, but it will pass an MoT emmissions test. The laptop has to be present, PC fuel map adjusted on line, with the Mot sensor up the tailpipe.

Yes indeed.. 1 on lambda is correct AFR because i am over its running to lean... Off to Bob Farnham tomorrow to borrow his Yoshi box and another day of tweeking..

alltho one has said to remove the clean air system and see what that does..

do they check the emissions with bonnet off or on?

at Gillingham centre when i was there that had the bonnets off and driving them around the yard etc..

Wthout the KLEEN system on the ZX9R, I couldn't get anywhere near the correct emissions.

i have been playing with my fueling all day now with a yoshi box on a gsxr 1000 ecu...

co and hc are well below but my lambda is high even after over fueling it.. the trouble is my cat works too well...

has anyone come across this with a bike engine and fast flow cat?

thanks in advance

Can you adjust the mixture at a set point, 2500-3000? Also, can you watch the lambda reading as you enrichen the mixture?

hi

seen it all today... just cant figure it out.. the best i can get lambda is AFR18.63 with Co5.53 and hc340

put back to standard with co 0.3 hc 48 but afr 23.86.. the problem is the cat drawing all those nasty gases out to well.. I really want to see its pre cat emissions but time is short now.. I might take the power commander off my bike but i don't think thats going to make any difference..

Have you tried blowing some compressed air into the tailpipe with the engine off?

I'd be very surprised if you engine would actually run at all if the true AFR is 23, surely you must be an exhaust leak where additional air is getting to the sensor.

hi

absolutely well and truly no blows and bad welding... all four headers pipes are leak free and the rest is all one piece.. been over it all with a fine tooth comb.. reads better with cat cold.. cat hot changes everything...

i am ready to remove it for good!

From my messing with the emissions, I found the cat didn't have any effect on the lambda reading, the lambda was almost the same, with or without the cat. As Matt says, it looks very much like an exhaust leak.
Can you measure O2? I would put money on that it will be high.
An exhaust leak would give:
Low CO
Low CO2
Low HC
High O2

A lean mixture would give:
low CO
Low CO2
High HC
High O2

It took me about 2 weeks and 5 gallons on fuel to get to grips with it, all the way through I wished I had
fuel injection, and a Power Cammander. Not so sure now

[Edited on 26-5-13 by 40inches]

surely a leak that would cause poor AFR would make fairy liquid bubble from cold.. i have compressed air so will make a bung and back fill it tomorrow... smells nice now tho...

I'm sorry you are not nearer, I have a full 5 gas analyser you could play with.
Would this be any help?

Another thing I found, was that after a few hours of low speed engine running, a new set of spark plugs worked wonders.

don't be sorry. I do appreciate all the info and help from you and others on here... Its a good job its not here as i'd be out there doing it right now...

one machine to another..

Does gsxr1000 have an air injection system?

I don't understand air injection systems beyond the fact that I think they put additional air into exhaust to help the CAT and that most people block these off!

bit more info here
https://www.motomummy.com/smog-block-off-plates/graves-suzuki/gsxr-pair-valve-blockoff-plates/

and enough search terms for you to google better than me.

yes it does have that set up....

going to tinker more tomorrow and will come back with results..

quote:

---

Originally posted by doobrychat
one machine to another..

---

back filled the exhaust today... and yes at 50psi and washing up liquid has shown a few very slight leak around the header pipe collars.. you cant hear or see it when its running.. i to have exhaust paste on the inside of the collars and a little round the edges.. going to get some new gaskets tomorrow and then pressure test it all again.. hopefully be set up and under the limits before thursday...

Nothing like a last minute drama eh?

Hi
Im in the same boat, i have my test on friday this week, loocking forward to it but i had the car in the garage today and we tried to get the emissons rigth with the PC but couldnt get it stable to get a pass reading. The engine was hunting. I did have a slight leak from the back box clamp but i putted it up and dont think its leaking now. At one point all readings were good but then it suddenly drifted. Not sure why. A guy is looking at it tomoz at a fair hourly rate but it he gets it right thats all i want. Failing that i take it to the iva and it fails on emisssions.
Cheers
Rog

i too have spent many hours with mine... first tune with a yoshi box then managed to get suzuki sds.. got fed up with flaffing around so i took the pc3 usb of my k6 1000 and fitted that and now bang on map for idle and fast idle...

told ya a pc3usb of a k5/6 1000 will fit a k1/k2... hehehehehehehe

That's good if ya got the readings ok, I have the k6 engine in mine. I am using the pc5. What sort of map values have you ended up with to get the reading ok? I was trying several different values which changed the reading but I just couldn't stop the engine hunting

slightly richer on (+6) 1000-1750 much leaner on (-13) 2000-3500 with 0% throttle position gradual increases to and from the point of checks..

0 everywhere else.. i have saved the map as my Mk mot map..

I had mine set similar to yours at 2500-3000 which was ok but then changed suddenly. Wondering if I have an issue somewhere else. The idle was set at -12 ish but was still rich. Having another tinker today.

set you idle to 14 or 1500 via the screw as it makes it just a little better... the limit is 1000-1500...

What type of cat are you using?

tiny fast flow cat... it came with the exhaust i got from fleabay...

Do you hav a link to the eBay item? I got mine off eBay. I had to weld it together. I'm not sure if its working properly. Was thinking of trying another type

bought it 6 months ago.. my archive history does not give a new link..

Top Gear 400 Cell High Flow Universal Catalytic Converter Exhaust Cat | eBay
Top Gear 400 Cell High Flow Universal Catalytic Converter Exhaust Cat

similar..

Hi
We had the same problem on our R1 engine, it was the Air induction system
causing the problem.
Took the air intake pipe to the AIS away from the airbox & fitted a stop valve
during the test gradually turned it down until it was off, Lambda was then fine.


AIS Shut off valve

Good luck

Looking at your archive picts, nice car but do you have a rear view mirror ? .

[Edited on 1/6/13 by renetom]

quote:

---

Originally posted by doobrychat
set you idle to 14 or 1500 via the screw as it makes it just a little better... the limit is 1000-1500...

---

hi there

well i first had as yoshi box then i had suzuki SDS system but still to no avail... then took the powercommander 3usb off my 1000 k6 motorcycle and mapped it with my laptop on a gas analyzer...


through iva now so i'll decat it and block off the clean air system and sort out a proper mapp for it

That must be a good feelin to get the iva sorted. Did you have the air system connected to get the emissions sorted? I've blocked mine. I'm close to getting them right just making sure there are no leaks anywhere that will upset the lambda ect

hi had the air system on...

i took the advise of another post in this category and got a bit excited with some exhaust paste to ensure no other air leeks getting into the system...

it looked a bit rough for my liking but its all cleaned off now...

I'm not sure when the air solenoid actually opens. At the positions for the test I think the valve would be closed. I think it only works on overrun? Ya my exhaust is leaking at the collector box pipe work connection. Guna put some clamps round to try and seal. It's knocking the lambda way out

the clean air valve is fully open at tick over then closes as the revs go higher on the k1 k2 model..

Hmm that's interesting, you had your idle at +6 on the pc. I wonder if running richer actually made it burn better? Did you manage to take the co reading before the cat? Just wondering how good your cat was working. I got the same cat as yours, it seems to be working good but needs to get pretty hot before it works. If I rich mine up any at all the co reads 3 % or so at the tail pipe

Sorry i can't remember what it was with a cold cat..

it did make a lot of difference with the cat hot and does take quite a while to get hot, it does depend on how far down the pipe it is.. I put mine as close to the headers as possible..

Ya my cat is next to the collector box. Can't move it any closer. Once I've got it air tight I'm hoping to have a stable reading. I'm am using one of those cheap gunson co readers at home. It's just to get an indication that its going in the right direction.

How do

Ive been in the local garage again today. Still not achieving the correct emissions. For both idle and fast idle, the lambda and hc was spot on. The co came in and read very low tgen suddenly went up to 2% or so. I set it up manually then let the auto tune do the work. Even when i set the target afr to 14.7, lambda went high but co and hc was spot on. Im not sure what more i can do realy, its doing my head in

Not sure if i have an issue with the engine or if its purely set up?

first thing is make sure the exhaust is 100% air tight.. to test mine i back filled it with air and some soapy water was sprayed all over it externally.. lots of places i thought wouldn't produce air, but did!! sealed them up and AFR went to a much closer figure then before..

then found the power commander was the only way to go..

cat was red hot and spent many hours tweeking with other software before the power commander went on.. i did spend £15 on fuel to map it as thats how long it was running..

I've got the exhaust pretty good. But I will check it again. Was your engine running steady? Mine hunts a lot so the emissions move around a lot. The lambda wasn't that bad, it was the sudden changes in co with a steady lambda reading? I would have thought an increase in co would upset the lambda

mine doesn't hunt at all... are you running a k2 1000 engine?

have you had your throttle bodies balanced?

[Edited on 18/6/13 by doobrychat]

K6 mine and ya balanced up ok. The difference I can see at the moment it the pair valve. I've blocked mine. Not sure if I should start again and reconnect it? A few people have said to block it.