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Balljoint tapers?
chrisg - 12/8/07 at 06:50 PM

Hey Up,

Can anyone remember what the taper on the Maxi baljoint is?

Also would anyone know what the taper of the BMW E36 front lower baljoint is?

Ta

Chris

rusty nuts - 12/8/07 at 07:12 PM

You mean its not in that new roadster book?
Sorry Chris , couldn't resist
PS 7.5 degrees rings a bell but probably wrong.

chrisg - 12/8/07 at 07:15 PM

Actually I DID know the Maxi one, can't find it now and I've slept since then!

cheers

Chris

Alan B - 13/8/07 at 01:58 AM

Almost certainly 1 in 8

1 in 6 as a distant second possibility.

t.j. - 13/8/07 at 05:57 AM

Ford transit tie rod M20x1,50 RHT: 15,50
Ford taunus/cortina ball-joint: 15,40
Ford Sierra ball-joint: 14,00
Bmw E36 lower: 14,40
Fiat 124 spider/125/132/argenta lower (inside spring): 15,00
Fiat spider upper(non spring): 15,00
Fiat Argenta/125/132 upper: 14,80
porsche 928 lower: 17,20

Maxi: not stated in my book

grtz



[Edited on 13/8/07 by t.j.]

chrisg - 13/8/07 at 08:27 PM

Thanks all!

T.j I'm not familiar with the way you've expressed the tapers.

For example what does 14,40 mean?

Cheers

Chris

t.j. - 14/8/07 at 05:36 AM

quote:
Originally posted by chrisg
Thanks all!

T.j I'm not familiar with the way you've expressed the tapers.

For example what does 14,40 mean?

Cheers

Chris


It's the angle in degrees.
So 14,40 is 14.40 degrees.

grtz

chrisg - 14/8/07 at 08:28 PM

Ah I see, thanks very much!

Chris

TheGecko - 15/8/07 at 07:19 AM

quote:
Originally posted by t.j.
It's the angle in degrees.
So 14,40 is 14.40 degrees.

With all due respect I think you're just plain wrong there.

I have a SIDEM ball joint catalogue which gives those same values for the various ball joints you've listed. However, the notes in the catalogue say that the number is the small end diameter of the taper NOT the angle. It is given in the usual European format with a comma marking the decimal place (SIDEM are Belgian).

My understanding was that almost all balljoint and tie-rod end tapers are either 1:8 (7.125 degrees) or 1:6 (9.462 degrees). This is why a Transit tie-rod fits into a Cortina balljoint socket. Or why I can put a Landcruiser tie-rod into the top balljoint hole of a Gemini (Chevette to you) upright. Diameter is the main issue here - taper is a distant second matter.

Dominic

t.j. - 15/8/07 at 08:51 AM



Damn, didn't know that. I didn't measured them either. I have the same SIDEM catalogue.

you are right in the explanation is stated: "Diameter of the ball pin"

I will U2U chris.

To bad, Maybe someone has a catalogue with angles?

chrisg - 15/8/07 at 07:49 PM

No problem t.j.

So the BMW E36 BJ is 1:8 taper ratio and the top of the pin is 14.40mm diameter?

and the Maxi one is 1:8.

Does anyone have a maxi joint handy they could measure the top of?

cheers

Chris

Edit: know that the BMW BJ has a M12 x 1.5 thread at the top, what about the maxi?



[Edited on 15/8/07 by chrisg]

rusty nuts - 15/8/07 at 08:08 PM

Maxi used UNF threads . Don't some manufacturers use Sierra uprights reamed to take Maxi lower ball joints? Perhaps M.K etc may be able to help with taper?

02GF74 - 17/8/07 at 09:55 AM

I'm with the gecko on this one. I did a bit of research in to tapeers and there are two "standards".

the figures given in the table are porbalby the price as it is not the angle nor the major/minor diameters; for example:

Fiat spider upper(non spring): 15,00
Fiat Argenta/125/132 upper: 14,80


how can the tape go from 15 to 0? (mm? that is bloody small taper) and 14 to 80!!???

no, it has to be price in euros!

TheGecko - 17/8/07 at 11:52 AM

quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74the figures given in the table are porbalby the price as it is not the angle nor the major/minor diameters; for example:

Fiat spider upper(non spring): 15,00
Fiat Argenta/125/132 upper: 14,80

how can the tape go from 15 to 0? (mm? that is bloody small taper) and 14 to 80!!???

no, it has to be price in euros!
Like I said in my first message above, the catalogue I have clearly shows that the figure is the small end diameter BUT it is in European numeric format i.e. they use the comma as the decimal seperator. So 15,00 = 15.00mm and 14,80 = 14.80mm. These are from a manufacturers parts catalogue which definitely doesn't have prices in it.

The latest version of the catalogue is available to download as a PDF from the Sidem web site but the latest ones don't have as many taper diameters listed as the older ones.

Anyway, hope this helps.

Dominic

Alan B - 17/8/07 at 12:14 PM

quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
I'm with the gecko on this one. I did a bit of research in to tapeers and there are two "standards".......................


Erm....as I said too in post 4....

There are actually others but 1:8 and 1:6 covers over 99% of the applications..with 1:8 covering about 80%

chrisg - 18/8/07 at 01:15 PM

Right, I've had a measure!

The BMW ball joint is a 1:8 taper with a top pin diameter of 14.264 (On my calipers) wich is close to 14.40 allowing for manufacturers tolerances.

Of the others I measured a large proportion have the 1:8 taper and quite a few have a very similar pin top diameter ranging from 14.1 to 14.6 including the 98-2001 Volkswagen polo and the f model Vauxhal astra 98-2000.

Still haven't got the top pin diameter of the Maxi ball joint but I could take the Roadster to bits if no-one has it.

Cheers

Chris



[Edited on 18/8/07 by chrisg]

bob - 18/8/07 at 01:33 PM

Has anyone tried the alfa 164 bottom ball joints, i keep hearing the sierra upright drops staight on these.

It would be interesting to see or hear of any results.