so whats the verdict
So we near the launch date and really i think it would help chris with some more views and a poll,i know most dont like change in any form myself
included but hey you never know it maybe a gain with more info who knows.
so whats the verdict
As a Locost builder it pains me to say that Kitcarbuilders more aptly describes the site in it's present format.
The focus of the site is moving away from scratch built cars towards a forum for seven kit types, a trend which I think will continue, due in part to
the amount of advice given not to build a Locost for various reasons, (skills required, time taken, resale value etc.).
My concern now is that if the site is opened up even more as a result of the name change that the seven focus will become lost amongst a plethora of
other kits.
I'm not sure that Chris isn't creating a monster 
All IMHO of course
Mick
I voted for keeping LOCOSTBUILDERS but actually what I really mean is that I would like see some recognition kept to show that this site caters for
home built cars as well as kits.
I wouldn't like to lose the primarily seven inspired theme (Locost or reasonably priced kit) which seems appropriate and relevant to most of the
builders here.
However if we can attract more expertise from builders of other cars then that can only be a good thing.....
Cheers
Mark
Kitcarbuilders might be a bit too wide - there would need to be a lot more subforums to cater for different kits/models. Perhaps it should reflect the
trend towards buying in chassis, etc. rather than making from scratch and become www.sevenbuilders.co.uk (not www.sevenbuilders.com as that belongs to
"Seven Builders Construction & Remodeling" 
[Edited on 26.07.2005 by Humbug]
I suggest 'sportscarbuilders' to take the emphasis off the kits.
www.bodgeitandscarper.co.uk
thats gonna be my new company website 
maybe not
ps i abstained on the vote, i have my preferences but its chris' call IMHO.
[Edited on 26/7/05 by JoelP]
My company name on the computer is I.Bodgit & co. 
Many a true word is spoken in jest, or was it Welsh?
I think "assembler" would cover a lot of kit car projects even better. I haven't welded anything and my chassis was pre-built. The major components on my car are recon 2nd hand. All I've built from scratch are the various brackets and fixings holding it all together!
Personnaly I think it is a good idea to generalise the site. However, It will be important to compartmentalise the site (eg sub forums),
My own interest is mainly the chassis design side, so discussions on how to build a Ferrari replica from beetle bits would not interest me much.
I think the emphasis of this site is and always has been on doing things yourself. Why do we want to do things ourselves if not for doing it to a
lower cost, and maybe a higher standard?
Kitcar building is all about doing things cheaper, otherwise you'd buy ready built!
Changing to Kitcarbuilder moves the emphasis to kits only.
Lowcostbuilder caters for all!
Leave it as it is!
Pretty please?
Terry
another previously suggested name which i think covers all is simply www.carbuilders.co.uk but i like www.sporstscarbuilders.co.uk more!
these keep the DIY ethos but also allows for kits and other rebuilds/renovation/conversion projects etc
Ned
[Edited on 26/7/05 by ned]
www.sportscarbuilders.co.uk - Great idea I'd vote for that
Cheers
Mark
Well looking at the results so far we're a pretty conservative bunch.
I've said this before : this forum is frequented by engineers and those that aspire to be engineers. That is not true of the other kit car
builder sites IMHO. I think that what separates you from the rest of us mere mortals is the fabrication of your own chassis. I really want a go at
this, but have not got the time. However, I learn a great deal by hanging out in the "chassis" forum and I'm grateful.
I doubt I'd have even bothered looking in the first place if it was named "a generic car builder forum".
I think therefore the name should try to differentiate between what is a "kit" and what is truly "home made". For me, the deciding
factor is in the chassis, and who made it.
My opinion is this : I believe that Vortx, Luego, MK, etc are all kits. Anything else, where the chassis is costructed by the builder (and the
bodywork, as is the case with Stephen Gusterson's car), is a true Locost, irrespective of what it actually cost to build.
Perhaps www.forum_for_car_builders_who_fabricate_their_own_chassis.co.uk?
How about Clubmanbuliders- Thats going to include probably 95% of the builders be them locost, mk, cat(*& BEC ect, I leaves a few out but even
most of them are topless and squat on the ground.
Dale
I also abstain from the vote as I think Sportscarbuilders is the best suggestion so far. It really sums up what everyone here is doing,
allowing for kits/scratch builts and sevens/non sevens and even modified production cars. Although most people here probably are building a kit of
some form, I think the name Kitcarbuilders is too specific, will fail to attract true scratch-builders/modifiers/tinkerers/garden shed engineers, and
will loose the sight its unique identity as a real grass roots car building community.
In fact i'd quite like a name that looks to the past, the origins of what we're all doing - something like Specialbuilders or, as suggested
above, Clubmanbuilders. But I think Sportscarbuilders is more relevant.
Liam
[Edited on 26/7/05 by Liam]
Sounds like a good night out to me . I'll vote for whatever they are in.
so does that mean those of us that bought a kit rather than build it from scratch are banned/discriminated against
shame
a name is nothing,its content that makes the forum
and in my opinion anything that promotes the uk kit car scene is a good thing
i bet theres more people on here that bought thier chassis(mk,mnr etc) than fabricated thier own
quote:
Originally posted by andy d (rizla)
"most of them are topless and squat on the ground"
Oops, guess I should read what I write, I guess that should be most are toppless and sit low to the ground. Although its nice to know My mind is not
alone in the gutter.
Dale
If the name has to be changed I agree with Sportscarbuilders .
This site is principally devoted to the seven inspired car whether home built or kit built.To call it kitcarbuilders would open it up to all builders
and would take the focus away from sevens. While this isn,t necessarily a bad thing i think you would end up trawling through tons of other stuff to
read what your realy interested in.It could become a logistic nightmare to organise and almost as difficult to use.If it aint broke don,t fix
it.Evolution not revolution.
Couldn,t we just be called Sevensandmore. or something like that it would be more accurate,but i,m sure cateringvan mght say something about it.
[Edited on 26/7/05 by ray.h.]
quote:
Originally posted by ray.h.
This site is principally devoted to the seven inspired car whether home built or kit built.To call it kitcarbuilders would open it up to all builders and would take the focus away from sevens. While this isn,t necessarily a bad thing i think you would end up trawling through tons of other stuff to read what your realy interested in.It could become a logistic nightmare to organise and almost as difficult to use.If it aint broke don,t fix it.Evolution not revolution.
Couldn,t we just be called Sevensandmore. or something like that it would be more accurate,but i,m sure cateringvan mght say something about it.
[Edited on 26/7/05 by ray.h.]
Calling it seven-anything would leave Chris wide open to attack by Caterham - "SportsCarBuilders" gets my vote, if we have to change.
rgds,
David
I'm hoping chris can read this thread and gain something from it,at least people have been constructive and thought about the rename.
AFAIK the change will happen,i just hope the original locostbuilders forum can be a sub section and keep its own ID.
Sportscar builders sounds good too me to, but Chris has obviously got his own ideas and reasons for the change.The main thing I consider important is
that people will still find the site or a link to it when searching for Locost on the web.
Paul
quote:
Originally posted by bob
I'm hoping chris can read this thread and gain something from it,at least people have been constructive and thought about the rename.
AFAIK the change will happen,i just hope the original locostbuilders forum can be a sub section and keep its own ID.
I feel that if the forum is open to all types of kit car, (assuming that others are more prevalent than 'sevens' ) it may make the site a
bit too busy, there will be masses of postings, and it will be a bit hard to wade thro.
Im often wrong.
In Chris's shoes, I would see it as an opportunity to make some money by making the site more comercial - its pretty well indexed on the web.
Not sure if this is good tho for the site, and there may be much change.
atb
steve
[Edited on 26/7/05 by steve_gus]
quote:
I feel that if the forum is open to all types of kit car, (assuming that others are more prevalent than 'sevens' ) it may make the site a bit too busy, there will be masses of postings, and it will be a bit hard to wade thro.
quote:
Originally posted by steve_gus
I feel that if the forum is open to all types of kit car, (assuming that others are more prevalent than 'sevens' ) it may make the site a bit too busy, there will be masses of postings, and it will be a bit hard to wade thro.
Im often wrong.
In Chris's shoes, I would see it as an opportunity to make some money by making the site more comercial - its pretty well indexed on the web.
Not sure if this is good tho for the site, and there may be much change.
atb
steve
[Edited on 26/7/05 by steve_gus]
The change is a REALLY bad idea
as stated it is chris's baby - if the change goes ahead as planned and people dont like it, they dont come back - people vote with their feet
(although in this case with their mice!)
[windup mode on]
BUT what about us contributors of recent, does that mean our "generous" contributions are being used to finance the new web site?
[/windup mode off]
( puts on metal helmet and runs ........... )
I dont think we are 'too big' at present. If you look at the list of members, altho there are 1000s there is likely only a hundred or so
really active members. I dont think you can actually unsubscribe (bit hotel california) so there are likely loads of dead accounts, or still borns.
the reason Yahoo (TOL) self destructed was the high a$$hole factor on there. Too many people prepared to slag others off and get into verbal wars. It
got such that if anyone posted something erroneous, or off topic insults were thrown.
(You will still see O/T in listings there for that reason - to calm the purists. You can tell David Jenkins (as was I) is a veteran off TOL as he
tends to use that terminology here sometimes). David of course is a good guy
Once, in my ignorance, I posted an engine poll. In it, two of the choices were crossflow and kent. I was (or the list was) informed in a most
unfriendly way that I knew jackshyte cos they are the same engine. In fact, even daring to post a poll got me shot down. Then I used the photo section
- which no one had till that point, and got accused of using too much.
I dont recall there being any insults, wars or major bust ups in the 3+ years i have been here. TOL was a war zone.
I hope that doesnt happen here.
atb
steve
[Edited on 27/7/05 by steve_gus]
quote:
Originally posted by steve_gus
You can tell David Jenkins (as was I) is a veteran off TOL as he tends to use that terminology here sometimes). David of course is a good guy
I'm actually a moderator on TOL...but I've not even looked at for months....
Here is fine....and I wish it didn't have to change...but if it must then I guess sportscarbuilder isn't too bad...."kitbuilder"
really misses out on the DIY element too much, even for those who buy a "seven" kit.....in reality IMO a "seven" kit is really a
locost with a purchased chassis....
Of course mine is a bit different anyway...isn't yours Steve?
yep. its different. Really must mention that more. However, it just reminds me that I would have finished 2 years ago if it wasnt so friggin
different!
atb
steve
[Edited on 27/7/05 by steve_gus]
My vote is with sportscarbuilder,but its still sad to loose the locost name from the site.
what about locostsportscarbuilders?
or perhaps a more accurate,
usuallylocostsportscarbuilders?
Led Zepplin didn't change their name when they became popular did they?
I'm building a locost, with six lengths of steel and a push rod x flow engine and am very proud of my association with this site, and have
introduced a few to our collective ramblings.
One convert is also building now his own locost.
The reason is simple,we are locostbuilders , most people who buy mk's etc aren't just buying to do things quicker but don't have total
confidence in their welding or premises to do so. Plant costs are a big factor if you build one. I've spoken to several who don't intend to
stop after the first one, me either.
Kit buyers aren't cheats or lesser builders, maybe we are the building snobs by reminding people that we builders rather building a kit car.
All welcome to this site but locostbuilders for me guys.
All IMHO
Regards
Escary.
off for the flak jacket, take aim guys
Looks like I'll have to change my sig. or risk the wrath of those big, butch Cobra boys
Marcus
* s i g h *
I'll miss you, Locostbuilders! I've learned a tremendous amount from this group of generous, humerous, and generally civil,
individuals.
May the spirit of the site somehow continue.
Pete Byar (23:29 Eastern Daylight-Savings Time, 31 July, 2005)
I think this thread is a bit rude as it's ChrisW's site and he can do with it as he chooses. AFAIK, he has purchased the domain names, so
debating alternative names for the site is moot.
But, as everyone else is sticking their oars in, I'll add my eight farthings.
I don't want to mix with any small-penis money-bragging bling-ridden Cobra, Lamborghini or Ferarri replicas or ABS wheel-arch-extended spotty
young hatchback-drivers. 
If some benevolent person with a server and plenty of time on their hands were to set up a new forum pertaining to all that is sporty and home-built
in Britain, then I too would approve the name Sportscar Builders.
I will wait though to see if, or how long it takes for the rot to become unbearable.
And if the unclean infiltrators do transpire I will probably delete the forum from my favourites and resort to emailing lengthy disertations to myself
on all matter of car related topics, then disect them and disagree with myself.
I think it would be a shame to lose the focus on locost type cars, and would also be concerned about the site getting bigger and more crowded as Steve
has said. I am just back from holiday and it has now taken me 2 hours to quick scan the site as far as this - how long would it take if it was all
kits?
sportscarbuilders would be more appropriate as far as I am concerned if it has to change - particularly as I am not building a kit.
My personal point of view.
I have no right to comment - the man who created this site and keeps it all going may call it whatever he likes. I have no opinion and don't
think a name change or a lack of name change will make any difference. To those in the know, it's the only place to discuss kit cars and will
remain so.
Certainly, it is my first point of reference to anyone interested in kit cars of any sort.
Locostbuilders is definitely something to be proud of for all who have contributed and to the proud parent(s).
I would point out the difference in spirit between kitcars and locosters (by locoster I include poeple who buy a chassis) That spirit is, can i do it?
I never did before, lets look on the site for advice, ok, I'll give it a go! When i read kitbuilders sites they make a big deal about making
there own bracket for an accelerator cable! That is what makes this site different, if a name change also changes that spirit, its not good. but, its
your site Chris...and to now its been excellent.
Tim
You can do "locost" even when you are building a kit. For example when I was building the Tiger I could have bought the engine mounts for ££££ from Tiger, but I didn't I made some myself. Same for the alternator bracket, rollbar not to mention the alterations to the chassis and body work to get everything to fit properly. It strikes me that most home built cars have a degree of fettling required to make things fit properly. So locostbuilders works for me. Most people find the site anyway when they are building a car of some sort.