You can see them here, any thoughts ?

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/004413.htm

I do not waste any time on this rubbish. People who do, have nothing else to worry about. They should get a good hobby or vocation.

Hasn't there been cartoons about other religions in the past?? did they all say death to the drawer??
If there hasn't been any other cartoons, maybe there should be, to show others how the rest of us treat the topic !!

Jason

It seems to me like the Muslims who are creating all the furore are labouring under the misaprehension that Europe is a Muslim state, with no free speech at all.

Am I the only person who thinks that this all seems to be leading up to something big ? I live in a city with many muslims and other ethnic groups, the divisions are getting stronger days by day.....

Mark I agree with all you have just posted, but a few bits could be worded slightly differently to avoid any 'racist' acusations
we had to fight Hitler to avoid his ways, I prey to who ever it never gets to that situation again !!

Jason

Well I travel Europe regularly and further afield from time too time, when i set foot on foreign soil i respect there beliefs customs ect........ a week in a Muslim country during Ramadan last year saw me a little hungry at times but that's where i was so that's what i did.........

That's why a lot of what CalvNix makes sense too me........ when in Rome.....

I know what you mean Tony. Everything seems to be heading somewhere nasty. Iran acting the way it is, the korea situation, China going mad and now bush says to turn away from oil. Seems to by trying to lesson his need to be "friends" with the east not be environmentally friendly. And who do we have. Tony bloody Blair. Some say Tony the Tiger. More like Tony the pu@%y.

How many british flags have gone up in smoke by thier hand?
.....Don't remember us making too much of a fuss.

quote:

---

Originally posted by CaLviNx
Hi

If I am accused of being racist then I am sorry, no I am not, But I am a patriot for the values of MY country.

Maybe we should be like France as france tells all its incomers that "This is France this is the way we do things if you dont like that then feck off, no veils allowed in schools etc"

All this "Iam a muslim, my religion say your laws can get stuffed" is bull, you can bet if we europeans went to almost any muslim counrty and attempted to do what they try here , we would soon be deported back home or worse jailed,shot,Tortured, hand chopped off etc.

It is time to take a stand and stand up for OUR rights and values, if that is labelled as being a rasict then yes I will stand up and be proud to be accused of that. I have nothing personal against any muslim just those who spout forth the stuff that devalues our Society, if you want to be in this country, welcome but respect our laws and our values, as they say while in rome do as the romans do, not attempt make rome into your own little muslim state

Rant over I step off my soap box and go lie down in a darkened room with soft lights

Regards

Mark

---

not very amusing, except the one about the virgins. Its just one of those things i guess. Interesting that the BNP fella called it an evil faith, possibly not far off the mark. Makes up for all the bolloxs he spouts on other subjects i guess...

on the news i spotted placards spouting death to europe,stop free speach etc,where was plod to arrest these cretins for insiting religious/racial hatred?
oh sorry only works if its a white man saying it dosnt it.
calvinx...nail head

"British" Muslims

"...europe take some lessons..."
what, you mean the lesson that islam produces muderous fokkers?
who/what is calvinx???

I find this whole situation very worrying, and difficult to come to terms with. Like Jon, I have also travelled extensively around the world for business, and worked in all kinds of "interesting" places.

Now, I'm conservative (with a small 'c' ) British, and hence by nature I'm all in favour of free speech. Even if I don't agree with what you say, I'd defend your right to say it anyway. But, I dislike (in the extreme) the hypocritical, commerical way in which these (so called) newspapers have published these cartoons, let alone the way the political "Far Right" have jumped on the bandwagon.

We Europeans live in largely secular societies, where individual rights are put above all else. Few of us would describe ourselves as religious, and even fewer regularly attend church. The same is not true of the majority of Muslim countries, where (by definition) the society is strongly religious in nature. Attacks on their religion are taken very personally by the majority. Think back to how we behaved back in the times of the crusades to gain a parallel.

Personally I feel the actions of these newspapers amounts to little less than provocation, not to mention being very distasteful. There is a significant difference between having a right, and choosing to exercise it. Rights come with responsibilities, and there ought to be a consequence for the actions that the editors of these newspapers have taken.

A couple of them (rightly to my mind) have now lost their jobs over this. If they really believed that their right to free speech was being restricted (something I really doubt), then I assume they were prepared for this, and so I feel little sympathy.

However, to counter this, I repeatedly hear that Muslims abor violence, and are a peaceful religion. However, I notice little or no outcry from the Muslim societies over their more extreme elements publishing videos of beheadings of kidnapped Westerners on the internet, or them taking concerted actions to identify and punish those responsible. Again, with rights come responsibilities ...

Bottom line: there needs to be some compromise, and toleration here ... both of which seem to be (sadly) in very short supply at the moment on both sides.

Cheers
Richard

[Edited on 3/2/06 by SixedUp]

you never know there might oneday be a political party that will get people voting again, i wonder will there ever be a political party that really represents what the public wants and i feel most think the whole countrys in a mess and unless somethings done hard and fast and a little extreme it will get a hell of a lot worse... rant over

I have heard some muslims tell me that islam is a tollerant and peaceful religion. I see see mulims storm a Danish embasy over a matter or a cartoon, I see muslims with guns chanting "death to america" and I hear threats of do what we tell you or we will kill you. I have difficulty tieing these two things together.

At university there were several muslims in one of my tutor groups. Two of them were quiet, respectable and respectfull. Helpfull, calm, patient and studious. The handed their work in on time, always got high marks and always helped other students who were struggling. The other 4 or 5 were lazy, opinionated womanising drunks who turned up late and graduated with poor results. I seem to recall that the 4 or 5 often shouted about Islam but the 2 actually believed in it.

I seem to see two types of islam, the religious one populated with peacefull tollerant people who read and practice the words of the qu'ran and the cultural one whose followers are more "vocal".

[Edited on 3-2-2006 by smart51]

A lot of people have learned lessons from 9/11.

Unfortunately, most of the lessons have been totally negative.

I cant see it dying down. Islam is NOT a bad religon, but there is going to be a lot more killing in the name of it.

the same could be said about catholics and protestants in ireland/NI. refering to smart51s comments

[Edited on 3/2/06 by JoelP]

On a lighter note, at work today I likened the reaction to the cartoons to PMT. Going way over the top at, as far as I can see, very little.

Yes, my colleague chirped, Prophet Mohammed Tension.

Just trying to lighten the mood, probably Jehad against me now.

Seems to me that if you are a muslim then you are not allowed a sense of humour.
There only cartoons for fcuks sake.........oops shouldnt post when i've had a drink....hic

lowenbrau and Jack D, just ice please.

Actually, balls to the ice give me it neat

[Edited on 3/2/06 by skydivepaul]

I also believe this is heading somewere very bad...

EXACTLY what I thought! The news showed some guy (white british) getting told off by police for shouting at their legitimate protest, whilst they were holding death to whoever placards. Isnt that incitment to violence or making threats to kill?

And those BNP guys got in trouble for a lot less.

Any persons faith that cannot stand criticism isnt a strong faith. It should hold up to more than a cartoon.

But I do see that in Islam, to represent mohammed is wrong, so fine, I accept that. If i was in their country. We dont have to follow their rules, in the same way they wouldnt follow our religious rules.

Printing those cartoons again was wrong tho as it was obviously a wind up.

I accept that some islamics (all?) were upset, I accept that they can protest. At the same time they should understand you cannot make death threats, and not everyone has to agree with their point of view or die.


I think some tolerance and balance is needed. on both sides

atb

steve

quote:

---

Originally posted by theconrodkid
on the news i spotted placards spouting death to europe,stop free speach etc,where was plod to arrest these cretins for insiting religious/racial hatred?
oh sorry only works if its a white man saying it dosnt it.
calvinx...nail head

---

I think the time for tolerance has come and gone. Islamic followers believe Islam will eventually rule the world. It is well documented. The west lean back and say " be tollerant" while the east say this is western oppression and Islam will dominate.
I think we should all take a good hard look at our selves and where we stand on morals etc. because something shitty is coming.

I know where I stand. The liberals in this county could well be its' downfall.

I know I'll get 'your a racist' etc but so
fu%k.

I dont cut peoples heads off with a knife in the name Christianity.

problem is, its all down to your perspective.

go back 600 years and we likely did cut off heads in the christian crusades.

I think the arabs see the western world as corrupting their way of life, in the same way you think they will corrupt ours.

nothing is inevitable - and at the end of the day, what exactly can you do about it?

Im as brit as most, but my surname is swedish from yonks back. so at some point I (and likely you) could have been an immigrant. If you start sending people away that dont fit the white and christian profile , that in itself will trigger what you fear. People will not stand by while they feel they are victimised further.

Printing those cartoons months after the event was only going to incite.

There is no such thing as freedom of speach. - thats a sham excuse used by the press. There are any number of crimes based on words - slander, making threats to kill, verbal assalt, racist chanting, homophobic statments - loads of stuff.

Saying that the cartoons should be published as its a statement of freedom is guff. Its not important enoughth to be worth the trouble it stirs up.

atb

steve

Opression and killing for any religion is wrong IMO....... but then so is making fun of other peoples faith.

Becoming intollerent of certain groups is not the answer from either side, but it is inevitable and dare I say human nature.

Well somehow I managed to miss this one...

Anyway I agree with those of you who say essentially ...'when in Rome'. Not that I am intolerant of other faiths, but I believe that if you live in a predominantly Christian society then you should respect their faith, feel free to practice your own, but dont ram it down each others throats. The 'minorities' in this country are still that..only around 6-8% of the population of the UK as a whole!

The Muslims that cause the problems are those fundamentals (every religion has its fundamentalists) who take the Koran (spell it how you wish) literally. For those who know anything about the origins of Islam then it may be obvious why they wish to destroy the west... There is a line in the Koran that translates to something similar to 'Islam shall not rest until Christianity is destroyed'. This is hardly suprising when you consider that Islam was born out of the aftermarth of a war at Mecca between the Christians and to be Muslims. The Christians won. A redheaded man calling himself Allah came down from the mountains and began preaching to the surviviors after the Christians had left, bringing about the start of the Islamic/Muslim faith. So its hardly suprising that the fundamentalists want to destroy the west as we are a predominatly Christain sector of the world. (Theres also their apparent loathing of the consumer society, but I think thats just an excuse myself...)

I must point out that I have many friends at university from various religions/faiths and they are all lovely people and I respect their faith and they respect mine.

David

good comment

atb

steve

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve_gus
problem is, its all down to your perspective.

go back 600 years and we likely did cut off heads in the christian crusades.

---

this must be the quote of the year so far:

quote:

---

"They want to know whether Muslims are extremists or not. Death to them and to their newspapers," he said.

---

Am I a racist ???

I know that if I had walked around with some of the placards Ive seen over the weekend at a football match I wouldn't be typing this now, well not from the comfort of my own home anyway, and what happens if you turn up at an airport and claim too have a bomb ? Let alone walk the streets dressed too look like you have one strapped too your chest, its gone mad, totally mad, religion ??? Glad I ain't got one.

I'll finish like i started, Am i a racist ?

there's a very unracist midpoint where we all live happily every after, doubt it will happen though. I think all humans are too quick to anger really, myself included.

You're a nice guy Jon, I dont think anyone could call you racist. Sadly, most people i know are either racist, prejudist or ignorant.

THATS JUST TOTALLY BOLLLOX!!!!!!


ooops - sorry




btw - search for mohammed and islam on wikipedia. It gives you a bit more of an insight of their thought processes. Islam has many shared fundamental beliefs as christianity at its core and some are a better approach. It even recognises Jesus - as a prophet not holy trinity.

For catholics, if a newborn dies without baptism, it goes to hell (thats pretty harsh!) - in islam a child is innocent and automatically goes to heaven

atb

steve



[Edited on 7/2/06 by steve_gus]

All religions have their good bits and bad bits. The most peacful of all religions is probably Buddhism, and is also the most forgiving. It can at times be rather strict though.

Its how you interpret it as to whether the 'bad' bits affect you or not. The same with all aspects of religion, you dont have to accept everything said, as long as you have the main belief and faith.

I dont like the catholic or CoE denominations for many reasons (and this isnt the place to go into why).

David

Funny thing is there are some very nice representations of el Prophet Muhammed in the Middle east dating back a few hundred years, which funnily enough haven't been torn down, destroyed etc! Don't understand these people.