red top engine
whitstella - 9/8/11 at 04:39 PM
i might be looking into a change once i have built my first kit and i'm thinking about a red top. can i have some advice about these engines and
alternatives. good and bad points please.
steve
joolsmi16 - 9/8/11 at 05:55 PM
I've just recently got my redtop going with the help of the members on this forum and I can't fault it over the past two weekends done over
200miles and driving full throttle as much as possible and returning 27-30mpg..
However my father took it out yesterday in the wet!! and you've guest it put it backwards into a hedge so now off the road again!!!!
lot of people on this forum who know redtop backwards so loads of help and companies like "yukspeed" supply all the parts required to do the
work..
Jools
blakep82 - 9/8/11 at 06:05 PM
you might consider the x20xev ecotec (as oppesed to the c20xe red top)
a little lower on power as standard (-20bhp or so) but just as easily tunable. same block used to connects up to type 9 gearboxes just as easy as the
red top
plenty more around, and usually in better condition too.
just remember you won't find one pre 1995
if you can find a decept red top in your budget, then go for it!
perksy - 9/8/11 at 06:26 PM
Afraid i'm biased, but they are a cracking engine 
Only problem being good secondhand ones are becoming a bit harder to find now
Alot of them are now being used by the Rally boys in their Escorts
There's loads of info on SBD's website including what to look for and what can be done to them to produce decent horsepower
They can have a few issues but then so can most engines tbh and none of the problems are unsolvable
But they're 150 + brake as standard and with the right carbs/injection 180 bhp is achievable (with good Torque aswell)
a Mate has a standard VX with arp rod bolts, simpsons exhaust and DTH throttle bodies and it made 202bhp on NMS's rollers
Have a 220 bhp one in mine using alot of SBD bits so if there's anything in particular you need to know please ask 
MikeRJ - 9/8/11 at 06:38 PM
Good points are that it produces lot of power and torque as standard, but is also easily tuneable to extract more. Strong realible engine with plenty
of aftermarket support.
Bad points are weight and size, especialy height. You will need a fairly shallow sump to get any ground clearance in a locost.
donn006 - 9/8/11 at 07:51 PM
hi ive had one in mine for 2 years now im now going down the turbo route so my set up will be for sale soon fully rebuild 2k miles ago pol/ported head
piper cams mbe engine managment gsxr throttle bodies
stevegough - 9/8/11 at 08:05 PM
I will add that they have two well - known weaknesses:
- one - the pressure relief valve can stick, dropping your oil supply pressure to vitals to zero.
- two - the cylinder heads can become porous leading to oil in the water and vice versa.
There are 'fixes' for both problems, so no real sweat.
I have had quite a few probs with mine, though......
I have a purely standard calibra one in mine, standard injection (the inlet manifold for this is massive - can give you fitting problems in a seven -
see the pics in my archive!!!!!) and standard ecu. Supposedly gives me 150 bhp, though I've never tested it - but it is a superb engine from a
driver's viewpoint. - Never regretted fitting it.
I blew up my first redtop (totally my own fault) - 2 months after getting the car on the road, I over-revved it for probably 12-15 secs because the
throttle jammed wide open. - It siezed and snapped a rod. - I located another engine (another LCB guy) for £350 - took me a couple of days to swap it
over - and back on the road and flying again!
Go For It - great choice!
loggyboy - 9/8/11 at 09:04 PM
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
just remember you won't find one pre 1995
I assume the 1995 date is a emmsions date of some sort? You will find ecotecs in late 93/94 cavs, calibras and omegas.
blakep82 - 9/8/11 at 09:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
just remember you won't find one pre 1995
I assume the 1995 date is a emmsions date of some sort? You will find ecotecs in late 93/94 cavs, calibras and omegas.
well, 1995 was the introduction date of the ecotec, so i presume many of those cars had thier original engines removed for transplants into corsas and
novas? and replaced with ecotecs to sell the car on? i don't know, but 1995 was the introduction date of the ecotec anyhow, so there may be a
few, but don't think you'll see any now
omega 24 v6 - 9/8/11 at 09:50 PM
When I was looking for a donor car it was a hit or a miss that anything POST 83 in a Cavvy or Calibra would have EITHER a redtop OR a X20XEV both as a
std fitment.
As Blake says though an XEV will be more easilly found and again will fit with the std redtop adapter bellhousing as the block is the same.
Incidentally the seh 2.0ltr 8valve has the same block as well apparentlly.
loggyboy - 9/8/11 at 10:35 PM
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
well, 1995 was the introduction date of the ecotec, so i presume many of those cars had thier original engines removed for transplants into corsas and
novas? and replaced with ecotecs to sell the car on? i don't know, but 1995 was the introduction date of the ecotec anyhow, so there may be a
few, but don't think you'll see any now
As omega mentioned, L/M was the change over, when I was hunting for mine for my Nova I was constantly frustrated when looking for an redtop for my
nova. I found an L reg SRI in the end with a DISPAC, but the ecotecs came in with the facelift. But as is common, manufacture date is often different
to registration date!
heres an 94 ecowank 1994 VAUXHALL CAVALIER LS 16V AUTO GREY | eBay
face lift (grey tops to rear lights) gives away its
manufacturing age.
blakep82 - 9/8/11 at 10:48 PM
ah, well you learn something new every day. good for me, i'm going to start looking for a 1994 ecotec for my iva test, then put my 1998 rebuilt
one back after lol, benefit from an easier emissions test...
loggyboy - 9/8/11 at 11:45 PM
Why not just find a redtop and have 20bhp for no extra effort?
blakep82 - 9/8/11 at 11:51 PM
quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
Why not just find a redtop and have 20bhp for no extra effort?
because i don't have 3 times the money for a knackered one to spend. i can make up that 20bhp by using bike carbs and a proper exhaust. the eco
bit was down to the injection system and cylinder head design, its easy enough to undo that.
when i got my engine a few years ago, it was £100, there were some for £50, but they were too far away. red top i would have been looking at around
£300 at the time, and it would have most likely been wrecked by neds in a nova or corsa, instead i got one from a man in his 40s, he bought it to
replace the engine in his vectra, which turned out to have a fixable fault (he bought it before the garage stripped his car)
MikeRJ - 10/8/11 at 07:52 AM
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
quote:
Originally posted by loggyboy
Why not just find a redtop and have 20bhp for no extra effort?
because i don't have 3 times the money for a knackered one to spend.
That's fair enough, they do demand a (justified IMO) premium. However...
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
i can make up that 20bhp by using bike carbs and a proper exhaust
You can also add at least 20bhp to the 20XE by doing the same things.
loggyboy - 10/8/11 at 08:27 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MikeRJ
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
because i don't have 3 times the money for a knackered one to spend.
That's fair enough, they do demand a (justified IMO) premium. However...
quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
i can make up that 20bhp by using bike carbs and a proper exhaust
You can also add at least 20bhp to the 20XE by doing the same things.
Exactly. and the cost doesnt have to be at a premium to ecotec, I picked up my donor for £210, sold bits so my engine cost about £-100, and that was
6-7 years ago when they cost slightly more.
Even if you do buy a redtop for £200 more than an ecotec, you show me a mod or combo of mods (apart from nos) thats adds 20bhp for under £200!
[Edited on 10/8/11 by loggyboy]
[Edited on 10/8/11 by loggyboy]