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X-flows dizzy
thepest - 4/5/08 at 07:09 PM

I have a 1300 x-flow with a set of weber 40's. What kind of dizzy is normally used with this setup? the one I have I had to use an angled cap to clear the carbs, and anytime I need to remove the dizzy I need to remove the intake manifold. Is this normal for 1300's or is there another type of dizzy on the market for such use?

stevebubs - 4/5/08 at 07:22 PM

angled cap is the norm

If it drives you up the wall that much, go megajolt or some other ecu - however, you'll need to find somewhere to mount up the VR sensor and the coilpack, so not trivial...

thepest - 4/5/08 at 07:24 PM

Thanks, is there a megajolt/squirt thread I can read? I have been wanting to experiment with something similar for a while and I wouldnt know where to start

stevebubs - 4/5/08 at 07:39 PM

http://www.dwjenkins.plus.com/dizzy-plug.htm shows how to make the plug...I'm sure David Jenkins will be along to explain his install shortly....

[Edited on 4/5/08 by stevebubs]

thepest - 4/5/08 at 07:41 PM

thanks,got anything for the Megajolt/squirt too?

paulf - 4/5/08 at 07:44 PM

I converted my crossflow to Megajolt , theres some photos in my archive.It is worth doing as it also gives shift lights and rev limiter and improves drivability.
The web site is here http://www.autosportlabs.net/index.php?title=MegaJolt_Lite_Jr._Users_Welcome
Paul.

[Edited on 4/5/08 by paulf]

David Jenkins - 4/5/08 at 07:56 PM

quote:
Originally posted by stevebubs
http://www.dwjenkins.plus.com/dizzy-plug.htm shows how to make the plug...I'm sure David Jenkins will be along to explain his install shortly....




Megajolt seems a bit daunting at first, but really it's very simple. The heart of the system is Ford's own EDIS ignition system, as found in all sorts of small Fords from around 1970s on. These can be found in scrap yards, or bought on-line from places like ebay. Along with this you'll the special coil and VR sensor - also from the same car as the EDIS, if you're lucky.

The VR sensor is mounted at the front of the engine, pointing at a special trigger wheel mounted on the crank pulley. With the EDIS unit, coil and sensor fitted you can now start the car - but it will be in limp-home mode as the advance is fixed at 10 degrees BTDC.

Here's where the MJ unit comes in - it takes a signal from the EDIS, waits a while and sends a signal back along a different wire, altering when the ignition fires. It decides when to trigger the EDIS from the speed of the engine and from either the throttle position or the inlet manifold vacuum, which tells it the engine load. You can draw up a map to decide what advance to give at a certain engine speed and load. You can get more info from the MJ website, at Autosport Labs.

The big benefits are rock-steady ignition, a big fat spark at all revs, and the ability to tune the map to suit your own engine. Oh - and a great big gap where the dizzy used to be!

Throttle bodies and megasquirt would be better - but sorting out fuelling maps, ignition maps and all that stuff is pretty daunting - MJ is far simpler! If you want to know what MS is all about, go and look at their website and read their disclaimer ("This is an experimental system and we take no responsibility..." blah blah).

[Edited on 4/5/08 by David Jenkins]

thepest - 4/5/08 at 07:58 PM

Thanks, looks like I am ordering me one then Can you tell me what are the advantages of having TPS over MAP if any?

David Jenkins - 4/5/08 at 08:00 PM

If you've got twin webber carbs then TPS will be far simpler - trying to get a proper vacuum signal from multiple carbs can be done, but it's not easy. MAP is theoretically superior, but TPS is pretty much close enough for us mortals.

yamapinto - 4/5/08 at 08:04 PM

there are no advantages in running tps over map map is exactly what the engine is doing tps is what it wants to do if your keeping the carbs stick with map

UncleFista - 4/5/08 at 08:09 PM

quote:
Originally posted by yamapinto
there are no advantages in running tps over map map is exactly what the engine is doing tps is what it wants to do if your keeping the carbs stick with map


Unless of course you're running dual carbs/bike carbs etc. and find it difficult/impossible to get a steady MAP reading

David Jenkins - 4/5/08 at 08:10 PM

Fine - but try getting a good and accurate vacuum signal from 4 inlet manifold tubes, without pulsing and without screwing up the mixture in each tube. As I said - it can be done, but it's fiddly and will need a lot of experiment.

On the other hand, the TPS pot is just fixed to the end of the carb spindle...

(Ha! Tony beat me to it... )

[Edited on 4/5/08 by David Jenkins]

thepest - 4/5/08 at 08:11 PM

So should I need to make up my own bracket on my weber carbs? and what kind of TPS should I use?

David Jenkins - 4/5/08 at 08:23 PM

I can't help with the bracket, but the MJ unit can calibrate itself with just about any standard TPS pot.

I'm sure someone will come along with ideas for fixing the pot to the carbs.

02GF74 - 4/5/08 at 08:32 PM

quote:
Originally posted by stevebubs
angled cap is the norm



I'm gonna have to disagree.

I havr both Bosh (orange cap) and Motocraft (Ford) distributor and the Bosch one is taller. The Bosch is the only one for whcih the angled cap is available - I haven't seen one of these caps but I have douobts as to whether this will fit on a 1300.

There are at least two different inlet manifolds - see Burton Power - the 1300 is angled more to allow greater clearance.

Even with one of those fitted, it is a struggle getting the motorcraf dizzy in - I have small rubber caps that allow the leads to hug the dizzy more.

megjolt does away with of all this.

UncleFista - 4/5/08 at 08:35 PM

quote:
Originally posted by thepest
So should I need to make up my own bracket on my weber carbs? and what kind of TPS should I use?


We used a standard Mondeo one, photos HERE

paulf - 4/5/08 at 08:39 PM

There is a weber type TPS fitted to some fords with single point injection, ie some escorts and fiestas.I have seen these used on webers with a simple bracket to support it and a disk fitted to the end of the carb spindle, i have also used Bosch sensors as used on peugots , vauxhalls etc and almost any sensor with a resistance of 5kohms upwards will work if it can be mounted.
I actually used a MAP sensor succesfully on mine with throttle bodys as at present i am using a megajolt for ignition and controling the injection with a seperate ECU.
Paul.

quote:
Originally posted by thepest
So should I need to make up my own bracket on my weber carbs? and what kind of TPS should I use?

stevebubs - 4/5/08 at 10:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
quote:
Originally posted by stevebubs
angled cap is the norm



I'm gonna have to disagree.

I havr both Bosh (orange cap) and Motocraft (Ford) distributor and the Bosch one is taller. The Bosch is the only one for whcih the angled cap is available - I haven't seen one of these caps but I have douobts as to whether this will fit on a 1300.

There are at least two different inlet manifolds - see Burton Power - the 1300 is angled more to allow greater clearance.

Even with one of those fitted, it is a struggle getting the motorcraf dizzy in - I have small rubber caps that allow the leads to hug the dizzy more.

Beg to differ... it's tight but it will fit!!

Link to picture of my Fury with a 1300 + twin 40s + side entry dizzy

You're certainly right about the differences in manifolds, though - the manifold for a 1300 on twin 40s is longer and raises the carbs up higher than the manifold for a 1600 engine...

quote:

megjolt does away with of all this.


Certainly does...so long as you can get a crank trigger fabbed up....


[Edited on 4/5/08 by stevebubs]

stevebubs - 4/5/08 at 10:15 PM

quote:
Originally posted by paulf
There is a weber type TPS fitted to some fords with single point injection, ie some escorts and fiestas.I have seen these used on webers with a simple bracket to support it and a disk fitted to the end of the carb spindle, i have also used Bosch sensors as used on peugots , vauxhalls etc and almost any sensor with a resistance of 5kohms upwards will work if it can be mounted.
I actually used a MAP sensor succesfully on mine with throttle bodys as at present i am using a megajolt for ignition and controling the injection with a seperate ECU.
Paul.
quote:
Originally posted by thepest
So should I need to make up my own bracket on my weber carbs? and what kind of TPS should I use?


Dellortos not webers but you can clearly see the TPS in this photo

thepest - 5/5/08 at 07:53 AM

Thanks everyone, I have enough info to get started. I will post again as I progress.... Cheers