James
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 06:53 PM |
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MG ZTT problems- headgasket?
Hi All,
Sorry for the long post but I'm trying to get all the info in there.
You'll be amazed to hear Girlfriend's Mum's 1.8 turbo MG ZTT has gone wrong! 2004, 50k miles.
The problem started when twice it's suddenly had a smell of "a struck match" a smell that's then gone away quite quickly.
So she took it to a garage (ex Rover) and they've told her it's a head gasket problem and that it needs changing.
I questioned this as I would have thought a headgasket would be either be good or failed, not "going".
So I just phoned them. He said that they've done a special test on the water and exhaust gas is getting into the water. He said I should google
"K-series headgasket problems" and I'd learn a lot.  Now obviously I know (a bit) about the K-series issues but I didn't
think this engine was a k-series?
Apparently there's some emulsification of the oil too.
Apparently the cooling system will then have to be flushed out or "the hoses will fail later". And to fill the cooling system it has to be
"pressure filled" because of air locks issues.
So a new head gasket at 8 hours work all because of a "burnt match" smell in the car twice.
He reckons he's got 3 others of this car in at the moment with the same problem.
I pointed out what (IIRC) I'd read on here that the K-series head gasket problem was a result of it over-heating through low coolant and then
the gasket failing. Because I'd warned her about this she checks the water level religiously and keeps it topped up!
He also mentioned, that there are circumstances of finding the bore liners have slipped down, not being able to easily get the replacement engines any
more and sometimes writing off the cars. 
Any thoughts? Does it all sound like a load of bollocks? They've had the car a week already and can't start for awhile because
they're so busy. This is the only thing that leads me to believe they're being honest- because they don't need the work! lol!
Any advice greatfully received. Again, sorry for the length of post.
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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big_wasa
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 07:04 PM |
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Is it loosing water ?
Mr BT is your man here
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Danozeman
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 07:08 PM |
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u2u british trident hes your man
Dan
Built the purple peril!! Let the modifications begin!!
http://www.eastangliankitcars.co.uk
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MikeR
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 07:17 PM |
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Question - why would a leaking head gasket cause a brief burnt match smell???
If the temp suddenly dropped / rose, i'd say maybe (as the pressure suddenly got released out of the system with the gasket letting go).
If the car ran rough or used oil or you found emulsification or .......
but i can't see why a brief smell in the cabin would be a head gasket, I would have thought more likely something electrical shorting.
Isn't BritishTrident an ex rover mechanic or something - sure he specialises in these engines, perhaps a u2u asking him to comment would be a
good idea.
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RichardK
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 07:26 PM |
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Tell you now it'll be the heater fan resistor burned out.. Easy way to test fan won't be working at low speeds is the most common failure
as it at the most resistance.
Cheers
Rich
Linky to expensive kit to fix it
Somebodies trying to rob you I reckon! You could just ebay search for the resistor pack itself and get
a new one for about a £30.
[Edited on 25/2/10 by RichardK]
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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big_wasa
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 07:49 PM |
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yep very common on rover / mg's are the fan resistors. But two out of the three normally pop in one go ?
its a fiver repair if it is them  ive done them twice since xmas in my zs.
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DRC INDY 7
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 08:00 PM |
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yes its a k series and the 1.8 is the worst one to have
if the gasket is on the way out then do now it will cost more later a lot more
theres is a better gasket out for these engines now which will stop the head gasket problems
steel gasket with special sealent and a shim plate along with steel dowls
https://www.facebook.com/groups/462610273778799/
Puddle Dodgers Club
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britishtrident
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 08:17 PM |
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Really doesn't sound like the symptoms a head gasket to me. Especially if the car isn't loosing water or oil and shows no sign emulsion
under the oil filler cap.
The origin of the smell could be a lot of things but knowing 75/ZT I suspect it is the heater plenum air intake drains are choked with leaf debris.
Cleaning these out should be done every two years or more often if the car is parked under trees. Because it involves partly removing the scuttle
air intake plastic covers and removing the access plate in the bulkhead behind the engine, it takes 30 minutes or so to do it properly but the Pollen
filter can be changed at the same time.
Another possible cause is antifreeze leaking on to the exhaust manifold either from the radiator cap or the top radiator hose having chaffed the fins
of the radiator -- this is quite common on 1.8 75 & ZT and is very often misdiagnosed as a head gasket problem. The pink/orange Havoline
Longlife OAT coolant that MG-Rover specified from about 2002 on has a strange smell if over heated.
Odd smells inside the car can also come from the heating and air conditioning system needing pasteurised and sprayed with deodouriser.
Even if it was a head gasket as long as the engined hasn't run to the point of melting the plastic covers it isn't a that major job, 4
hours at most to do the job properly plus a new Freelander spec head gasket and inlet gasket and Havoline OAT longlife coolant. Contrary to what a
lot of parts sellers will tell you no other new parts are required.
[Edited on 25/2/10 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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RichardK
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 08:49 PM |
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It was this para that made me think it was the resistor, surely if it was the other things the smell wouldn't disappear so quickly?
"The problem started when twice it's suddenly had a smell of "a struck match" a smell that's then gone away quite
quickly."
I know BT knows his onions so we'll see who's right!!!
Cheers
Rich
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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James
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| posted on 26/2/10 at 01:29 AM |
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Thanks for all the advice everyone!
Is the idea of exhaust gas getting in the coolant a credible one? And that they can test for it?
I seem to remember hearing something about this once (on here probably).
The garage said something to her about a problem with the cooling fan. Although he didn't mention it to me when I spoke to him.
A burnt resistor does indeed smell pretty bad.
I'm tempted to go down to the garage tomorrow/weekend with the spare key and have a poke around the car and see what I can find.
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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britishtrident
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| posted on 26/2/10 at 09:00 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by James
Thanks for all the advice everyone!
Is the idea of exhaust gas getting in the coolant a credible one? And that they can test for it?
I seem to remember hearing something about this once (on here probably).
The garage said something to her about a problem with the cooling fan. Although he didn't mention it to me when I spoke to him.
A burnt resistor does indeed smell pretty bad.
I'm tempted to go down to the garage tomorrow/weekend with the spare key and have a poke around the car and see what I can find.
Cheers,
James
If the head gasket is properly blown yes the test used by garages is to use poke exhaust emission tester probe in air inside the header tank, there
is also a chemical test available.
But for a K series head gasket to fail enough to show exhaust gas in the header tank I would expect a lot of oil to be to showing up in the coolant
.
The original Paynes headgasket fitted by MG-Rover was an aluminium gasket with factory applied beads of silicone sealer to seal between the water
ways and the oil passage ways on the engine.
Eventually after x thousand cold starts these sealant beads don't seal so well, coolant gets into the sump and oil into the water. How long
before the gasket starts to weep depends on the number of cold starts and how the vehicle is driven when cold --- gunning it after a cold start on a
winters morning isn't a good thing.
The modified gasket issued by Landrover under Ford ownership is of multilayer stainless steel allows a certain ammount of designed in slip between the
head and gasket and gets round the problem, a similar design of gasket is used on all KV6 engines used in the Rover 75 and Freelander.
This type of gasket failure isn't a major problem to fix unless the engine gets really cooked.
More info in this thread
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=129802
[Edited on 26/2/10 by britishtrident]
[I] “ What use our work, Bennet, if we cannot care for those we love? .”
― From BBC TV/Amazon's Ripper Street.
[/I]
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James
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| posted on 26/2/10 at 08:15 PM |
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Thanks for all the help everyone!
More investigation needed I guess.
Cheers,
James
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"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
- Muhammad Ali
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