Hi guys!
I'm currently welding my chassis but the day that I will put my engine into it is closing in.

I've choosen the egine already:
Saab LPT, a turbo with original 150 hp and 210 nm.

Now to the real problem, the gearbox. I have two choises:
1. Opel gearbox, probably one from a 2.2 TID as it is the strongest gearbox fitting to the engine.
2. Ford Type 9 with a Adaptor plate to make it fit to the Saab engine.

Well if I don't tune the car either of them will probably work... but you see, with this Saab engine you can tune it really well with just some key-hits on a computer
So from 150 hp and 210 nm to:
1. 220 hp and 320 nm
2. 265 hp and 370 nm

Now here is the problem,
Will the Ford Type 9 stand these forces?
As the Type 9 gearbox is much cheaper and smaller than a Opel gearbox.

The car weight will be around 700 KG. And use a Volvo 240 rear axle.

Maybe someone got some data on the Type 9 gearbox?

Best Regards
Henrik

(sorry for my english if it is bad )

Hi Henrik

The type 9 should be ok with your engine at standard tune, allot are used with zetecs and their about 160 bhp, you can get stronger internals from quaife www.quaife.co.uk which they claim will cope with 275 bhp

Or if you want use a really strong box theirs always the T5 as fitted to 2wd cosworths

Adrian

Sorry to disagree, but a standard type 9 will most definitely NOT be ok with this engine in standard tune. There may be many zetecs out there making similar power, but this is of little relevance, the torque at 210nm will break the 'box very quickly. To use the type 9 you will need a gearkit in it and heavy duty mainshaft and layshft assemblies.

The Opel 'box which as you say goes straight on, would probably be the easier option. Don't know anything about this 'box strength wise (but I do know it is a lot stronger than the type 9, as you say the diesel 2.2 is very torquey too so will put similar stress on the 'box, you are thinking along the right lines here!).

Best place to find out would be www.mantaclub.org, the uk opel Manta owners club. There are a few Opel Manta's out there with Saab Turbo's attached to Opel 'boxes so those people would be the best to ask.

[Edited on 19/5/04 by NS Dev]

Hi

Why is 210nm excessive for a type nine?

the 2.9 v6 used it and had more, dont forget his car will be allot lighter than the donor and wheelspin takes alot of stress off the box

A vauxhall box might be simpler and i know a few XE owners use carlton boxes, maybe a 3.0 box would be strongest?

The V6 box isn't identical internally- has uprated layshaft bits IIRC.

James

Hi James

Yes the V6 type 9 is the strongest, But as Henrik was suggesting using a type 9 with an adapter plate i assumed he was talking about the V6 version because its input shaft is an inch longer

Adrian

Yes James you are right, the V6 "uprated" type 9 used different layshaft, layshaft bearings and a modded casing to allow fitment of bigger bosses to mount the layshaft bearings in. In any case the "uprated" type 9 was never used with the 2.9 v6. It was used with the 2.8 v6, but was very marginal, most 5 speed Capri 2.8's have ropey gearboxes (mine did!) and the XR4i also blew gearboxes with some regularity(one of the ones I drove did!), hence the use of the T5 'box on the cosworth 2wd.

A lot of people do use the Carlton 'box or 1800 manta 'box (the same, both Getrag 240), as I did when I built my 16v manta. This made around 210nm of torque (xe engine on throttle bodies) and blew 3 of these gearboxes up in 5000 miles.

The 2.2 turbodiesel (Omega) 'box mentioned is a different 'box altogether, I am fairly sure it is a later version of the Getrag 265, as fitted to the old manual Senator and Carlton GSI 24v.

quote:

---

Originally posted by ady8077
Hi James

Yes the V6 type 9 is the strongest, But as Henrik was suggesting using a type 9 with an adapter plate i assumed he was talking about the V6 version because its input shaft is an inch longer

Adrian

---

Hi
I thought the early Mk3 Granadas used the Type 9?
I fully agree the type 9 was marginal in alot of fords, but in a 700 Kg car it will handle a lot more. They are also very easy to get modified to handle even more
SSC are using a BGH box for their 225 bhp RT and Tim doesn't drive it gently :-)

As for using a Getrag 265, that is a very strong box and if it is standard fit to the 2.2 would probably be the best

As for the comment about the adapter plate, how would you use a 4 cyl box? I've only seen adapter plates fitted to V6 boxes using 4 cyl bellhousings?

Adrian

Hi Adrian,

yes the granada mk 3 used the type 9 briefly but the early mk 3 also used the 2.8 ( but are you thinking it was the 2.9 cos of the strange inlet plenum, the early 2.8 granada mk 3's used an inlet chamber casting not unlike the 2.9 engine, it was a bit different but not like the 2.8 one)

The 2.9 and MT75 'box were introduced together. I also had a mk2 granada 2.8i with type 9 manual 5 speed, and have to say this wasn't too bad (the synchro was shot on 2nd but that is irrelevant really!)

Anyhow, see where you are coming from on the using the v6 'box to give enough length for an adaptor plate, must admit I hadn't thought of it that way before! Then that made me think and the obvious hit me, if you were to use the type 9 with the Saab engine you don't need an adaptor plate!!!! You can use the off the shelf bellhousing as used to mount the Vauxhall 1.8 and 2.0 engines to the type 9! The bolt pattern is the same (obviously as you can use the GM 'box with the Saab engine).

Cheers

Nat.

With a car that only weighs 600kg strengths of gearboxes/axles seem to be less critical?

My mate has a stryker with a 270bhp cossie lump in it and i was suprised to learn he runs it all through a stock escort axle with no known breakages!

I assume that its because you are more likley to spin up and loose traction before the torque breaks anything??

Doug.

That's certainly true to a large extent, particularly with axles, but it also depends on the application. There are rally escorts around which weigh in the high 700 to 800 kg range which break bits regularly due to the constant loss and regain of drive to each of the rear wheels, snapping halfshafts etc.

Thanks guys!
I think I've decided, its going to be a Opel gearbox, first a cheap one for just testing and later on a 2.2 TDI, thanks again!

best regards
Henrik