nick205
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 10:22 AM |
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Pinto block breather - another question!
I know this has been covered before, but I can't seem to find clarification.
As per my earlier post I'm planning to fit this Burton Power breather elbow to my Pinto and route to my newly fitted catch tank.
For those familiar and using RichardK's pic below....I've removed the vaccuum valve part from the metal can on the side of the block and
had assumed that the Burton part simply pushed into the metal can.
Is this right or do I need to prise the metal can part out of the block and the knock the Burton part straight into the block?
I'm confused....?!?!?!
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Mr Whippy
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 10:30 AM |
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I thought the can was effectivly a small catch tank, its full of chicken wire IIRC, without it I think the oil will go up the hose but seeing that you
are fitting a new tank then ditch the old one
[Edited on 14/1/09 by Mr Whippy]
Fame is when your old car is plastered all over the internet
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 10:59 AM |
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I always thought the burton one was ment to go strait into the block (but I could easily be wrong)
there are loads of threads on hear about pinto breathers / catch tanks - if you search around you'll find the setups other people are using and
any issues they've had
(e.g. click )
some people use the old cortina style one (kidney box thing) but with the valve removed
this is my own version which I'll fit strait to the block:
(I've made it in 2 parts so I can easily add a valve/ baffle later if needed)
[Edited on 14/1/09 by mcerd1]
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DarrenW
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:07 AM |
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The can acts as an oil seperator to remove some of the heavier oil particles befor ethe vapour is fed back to the inlet manifold. However its probs
not needed if piping to catch tank. Ive fitted a cortina style trap and piped this directly to the catch tank. However i saw the need to use a
seperator of sorts due to some early issues i had with modded sump / incorrect dip stick etc resulting in overfilled engine. Since correcting the oil
volume i get very little spoils in the catch tank so in theory should be able to replace cortina breather with a burton adaptor.
Problem with pinto breathing is there are so many solutions that seem to work and so many 'problems' that were possibly caused by the user
(mine included) that there isnt one simple definitive solution that is widely accepted. All are based on trial and error. Give the burton adaptor a go
straight into block but keep everything you take out for a while just in case.
Try and run the hose vertical at first and then across to the catch tank. This worked for me. Ive heard reports of more spoils in a catch tank if the
hose run is low and the catch tank is low down.
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nick205
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:15 AM |
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Right then...I'm going to leave the can in place and fit the Burton elbow into it and see how that works first. If unsuccessful then I can
always remove the can and fit the elbow directly to the block.
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DarrenW
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:27 AM |
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looking at the burton bit again, it probs has a stepped diameter to allow fitting in either location. Your plan seems sound to me. If all else is good
it should work no probs at all.
i did always think originally that the burton part is a replacement for the PCV. I modded my own as a cheap option but then didnt like the small
diameter outlet from the originbal PCV.
I have also tried just pushing the hose into the grommet on top of the can and saving the cost of a shiny bit.
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02GF74
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:38 AM |
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my version, if I had a lathe and I need one, would be just like your version but with a groove cut to accept an o-ring. 
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nick205
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:38 AM |
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Darren,
I also looked at the Cortina unit, but it seemed most people had difficulty securing it in place - seem to remember pics with it cable tied
in-situ.
Before buying the Burton elbow I looked at the straight through/vertical breather adapters on Ebay. My thinking however is that vapour will pass
90deg easily whereas oil will be impeded alittle and hopefully run back down into the block before ever reaching the catch tank.
I'm fitiing the tank as high as possible on the scutlle bulk head and will also be T'ing a pipe in from the rocker cover breather too.
Time/miles will tell...!
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nick205
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:39 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by nick205
Darren,
I also looked at the Cortina unit, but it seemed most people had difficulty securing it in place - seem to remember pics with it cable tied
in-situ.
Before buying the Burton elbow I looked at the straight through/vertical breather adapters on Ebay. My thinking however is that vapour will pass
90deg easily whereas oil will be impeded alittle and hopefully run back down into the block before ever reaching the catch tank.
I'm fitiing the tank as high as possible on the scutlle bulk head and will also be T'ing a pipe in from the rocker cover breather too.
Time/miles will tell...!
Not measured it yet, but I think the idea is that it forms an interference fit. i.e. you have to smack it in with a hammer 
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 11:56 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by nick205
Not measured it yet, but I think the idea is that it forms an interference fit. i.e. you have to smack it in with a hammer
they should all have an interference fit into the block (mine included) - just tight enough to need a little persuasion
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 12:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
my version, if I had a lathe and I need one, would be just like your version but with a groove cut to accept an o-ring.
if you want one made - you can send me a sketch/ drawing.....
btw - mine has an o-ring inside the top half
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nick205
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 12:17 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1
quote:
Originally posted by 02GF74
my version, if I had a lathe and I need one, would be just like your version but with a groove cut to accept an o-ring.
if you want one made - you can send me a sketch/ drawing.....
btw - mine has an o-ring inside the top half
mcerd,
Just looked at the full size photo of your parts - very swish! I like the idea of a threaded/removable section with O ring seal a lot 
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DarrenW
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 12:27 PM |
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My Cortina trap was one of those held with a cable tie until i realised the sierra can was removable and the cortina trap also fitted straight into
the block. i think i still use a cable tie but only as a security measure. Its not that tight a fit in block and i dont recall seeing any leakage.
i think your solution follows sound logic. Cant see why it wont work. My catch tank is in same location too. I also run a hose from filler cap to the
tank to vent off the rocker cover gasses too.
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 01:53 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by nick205
mcerd,
Just looked at the full size photo of your parts - very swish! I like the idea of a threaded/removable section with O ring seal a lot
here's a quick sketch of the inside of it if your interested:
sorry about the poor quality sketch - I'd normally have a CAD drawing, but I made this one up as I went along and didn't measure any of it
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mookaloid
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 01:56 PM |
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One point I would make is that on a standard engine the breather system which is plumbed into the manifold - it creates a vacuum inside the crankcase
which discourages oil leaks.
We can't recreate the vacuum with an open breather system with a catch tank so we can only do our best to make sure that the air flow to the
catch tank is as unrestricted as possible so that crankcase pressure doesn't build up. Also the tank should be a reasonable size so that the
air pulses can be absorbed. I think it needs to be at least a litre or more in size.
I notice that the two home made devices above both significantly reduce the airflow as they reduce the available area considerably and could actually
cause back pressure. Try blowing hard through a thin tube and then a wide hose to see the difference in effort.
If after fitting these adapters in the breather system you have oil leaks, this could be why.
Cheers
Mark
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 02:02 PM |
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^^^ I have been wondering about the size of the outlet on my adapter - but I can always make another top half if its a problem
its about the same size as the inlets on most catch tanks I've seen - but I'll only find out if its enough when I try it.........
[Edited on 14/1/09 by mcerd1]
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mookaloid
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 02:33 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mcerd1
its about the same size as the inlets on most catch tanks I've seen - but I'll only find out if its enough when I try it.........
You will indeed! however, as the restriction is at the engine end, you won't benefit from the volume of air in the hose itself which if it had a
clear run to the catch tank you would.
I would also question whether a small bore inlet catch tank is really as good a design as a larger inlet breather/catch tank.
Good luck
Cheers
mark
"That thing you're thinking - it wont be that."
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mcerd1
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| posted on 14/1/09 at 02:43 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by mookaloid
Good luck
cheers - I'll need it
its just as well its an easy bit to change later - the plan is I'll experiment a bit first, then post my findings/ questions
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