MK9R
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 06:22 PM |
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RANT 2: Reduce spending on further education but increase benefits
following on from my thread a couple of weeks ago
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=126461
So now this fantastic government thinks saving £400million by cutting further education and fining universities £3700 for every extra student it takes
on over the allocated numbers BUT then piling extra millions more into the work shy benefit giveaway!!!
Reward the spongers and punish the potential people who are needed to fund the ever growing non contributing population
Cheers Austen
RGB car number 9
www.austengreenway.co.uk
www.automatedtechnologygroup.co.uk
www.trackace.co.uk
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Anne Onymous
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 06:36 PM |
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Congratulations! It must have taken some doing on (this forum), but you win the award for the most small minded, half witted, thoroughly offensive
post on here. Well done.
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balidey
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 06:42 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Anne Onymous
, but you win the award for the most small minded, half witted, thoroughly offensive post on here. Well done.
Err, looks like your small minded, half witted, thoroughly offensive post is a close second.
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Cousin Cleotis
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 06:49 PM |
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What is the point of educating people when there aren't the jobs? Unemployment is rising more people are signing on the money has to come from
somewhere.
Paul
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UncleFista
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 06:53 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Cousin Cleotis
What is the point of educating people when there aren't the jobs? Unemployment is rising more people are signing on the money has to come from
somewhere.
Paul
Bingo !
I read a few months ago that the government want half of all school leavers to go on to get a degree.
WTF are they gonna do after leaving uni with a degree ?
Are we just gonna have millions on the dole while we bus in eastern europeans to do the "real" work ?
Tony Bond / UncleFista
Love is like a snowmobile, speeding across the frozen tundra.
Which suddenly flips, pinning you underneath.
At night the ice-weasels come...
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balidey
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 07:00 PM |
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But you can't stop educating people because unemployment has reached critical mass.
Obesity has reached a higher level, so do we stop producing food.
In my mind its more to do with 'cause and effect'. If unemployment is too high find out why and remedy that. Its probably more to do with
the way our industry has been shafted over the years.
Too many people, not enough jobs. So either create more jobs, or reduce the number of people. The solution offered above dose neither, it just means
the number of people without jobs are uneducated. Great, just what we need.
But to stop or limit education seems ridiculous to me.
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tegwin
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 07:05 PM |
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Yes there are a shortage of jobs... but we still need well educated graudates to fill those areas that need workers... and we will eventually pull
out of this hole.... when we do we need more trained people and less dossers...
By the posts above I get the impression that you are resigned to collecting benefits and have no aspirations to go and learn new skills.. Joy!
On a different note... why do I get the feeling the gov will cut funding for "proper degrees" IE medicine, engineering etc.... and not
touch the pointless "media football" degrees....
[Edited on 23/12/09 by tegwin]
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Would the last person who leaves the country please switch off the lights and close the door!
www.verticalhorizonsmedia.tv
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smart51
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 07:09 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by UncleFista
I read a few months ago that the government want half of all school leavers to go on to get a degree.
Getting half of them with 5 "good" GCSEs would be a good start.
Look how Anne Onymous' first post is to criticise the opinion of a regular poster. Do you think they registered especially to make that
reply?
As for the OP, we're having a spot of financial bother at the moment. Cutting HE budgets for a year is unpleasant but perhaps preferable to,
say, treating cancer patients. Given the level of bother putting up anything sounds like the wrong thing to do. If we were going to put something up
at the moment, benefits wouldn't be top of my list.
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MK9R
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 07:20 PM |
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i'll ignore the first post as its been posted by someone without the bollox to do it under their own login or just a randomn halfwit.
Not sure if my post came across correctly, I agree we have to cut spending to get us out of debt, and if further education or even (god forbid) NHS,
Policing etc then i can accept it, but not when spending is increased on the biggest single flawed system draining this countries budget!
Cheers Austen
RGB car number 9
www.austengreenway.co.uk
www.automatedtechnologygroup.co.uk
www.trackace.co.uk
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hampshe
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 07:37 PM |
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Everybody has a right to their opinion, the first poster is obviously a d**k head for being so rude about a regular poster, shame they cannot be
blocked somehow
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Dangle_kt
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 08:08 PM |
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the first reply may have been from someone who has recently lost their job... there are a few regularls on this forum- and if so then I don't
blame them for not using their regular login as they are having a rough enough time already without having to put up with someone calling them
"work shy" or "spongers"
I dont disagree with the original post though - its not the best use for a government who are skint - but to be fair I bet its only tiny compared to
how much Britain is spending on medeling in other countries domestic situations....
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mr henderson
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 08:11 PM |
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There's no doubt that there is an obscene amount of money wasted in higher education, much of it on courses that have no application to the
world of work (history of art, engilsh literature, medieval studies etc etc) and that many students treat their three years as a sort of holiday.
The only way the government can get universities to focus on what is really important and what isn't is to reduce the funds.
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JoelP
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 08:24 PM |
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unis should charge more for less useful courses, so proper degrees should be well subsidised, but something like 'surf studies' (from
plymouth apparently) should be paid from the students pocket.
Cant comment on the benefits system changes, as i dont know what aspect has changed. However, theres definately scope for saving money in there
somewhere!
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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StevieB
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 08:39 PM |
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Dangle, I think there's a distinct line that needs to be drawn between those who are currently out of work and need to claim benefits (ie, those
who have made a significant contribution to the system already and will be working again as soon as they can), and those who sponge off the system
withour any intention of making any contribution to society in general (never mind the government coffers).
I don't know everyone on this forum in person, but I would be willing to wager that by the very nature of the hobby that brings people here,
they are unlikely to be the work shy types!
With regard to education, the reason the government would want people to stay in education is to keep them off the unemployed stats - at least until
the economy starts up again and there's jobs once more.
There's been some talk of cutting the costs through reducing the length of a degree course. I think the best wayt o do this is to get rid of
summer holidays and just stick a 2 week break in there instead. That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
That would reduce the cost of eductaion to the students/parents rather than the state, which IMHO is more important than cutting government budgets.
There's been far too much baling out of institutions/banks and cutting of budgets to fund the bale outs. All the while, those who pay taxes are
suffering and the only return/support we all receive is the dole money we get when our employers/businesses fail and put us out of work.
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Dangle_kt
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 08:52 PM |
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Thanks Stevie, your absolutly right- I think the original post lumped everyone in as a waster if on benefits - which as you pointed out is not the
case.
Maybe someone was having an understandably bad day and took things the wrong way. hence the reply.
I was just pointing it out, as everyone was getting mad about the reply, and figured I'd try and give a possible reason.
quote:
Originally posted by StevieB
Dangle, I think there's a distinct line that needs to be drawn between those who are currently out of work and need to claim benefits (ie, those
who have made a significant contribution to the system already and will be working again as soon as they can), and those who sponge off the system
withour any intention of making any contribution to society in general (never mind the government coffers).
I don't know everyone on this forum in person, but I would be willing to wager that by the very nature of the hobby that brings people here,
they are unlikely to be the work shy types!
With regard to education, the reason the government would want people to stay in education is to keep them off the unemployed stats - at least until
the economy starts up again and there's jobs once more.
There's been some talk of cutting the costs through reducing the length of a degree course. I think the best wayt o do this is to get rid of
summer holidays and just stick a 2 week break in there instead. That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
That would reduce the cost of eductaion to the students/parents rather than the state, which IMHO is more important than cutting government budgets.
There's been far too much baling out of institutions/banks and cutting of budgets to fund the bale outs. All the while, those who pay taxes are
suffering and the only return/support we all receive is the dole money we get when our employers/businesses fail and put us out of work.
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MK9R
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 09:14 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Dangle_kt
Thanks Stevie, your absolutly right- I think the original post lumped everyone in as a waster if on benefits - which as you pointed out is not the
case.
Maybe someone was having an understandably bad day and took things the wrong way. hence the reply.
I was just pointing it out, as everyone was getting mad about the reply, and figured I'd try and give a possible reason.
quote:
Originally posted by StevieB
Dangle, I think there's a distinct line that needs to be drawn between those who are currently out of work and need to claim benefits (ie, those
who have made a significant contribution to the system already and will be working again as soon as they can), and those who sponge off the system
withour any intention of making any contribution to society in general (never mind the government coffers).
I don't know everyone on this forum in person, but I would be willing to wager that by the very nature of the hobby that brings people here,
they are unlikely to be the work shy types!
With regard to education, the reason the government would want people to stay in education is to keep them off the unemployed stats - at least until
the economy starts up again and there's jobs once more.
There's been some talk of cutting the costs through reducing the length of a degree course. I think the best wayt o do this is to get rid of
summer holidays and just stick a 2 week break in there instead. That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
That would reduce the cost of eductaion to the students/parents rather than the state, which IMHO is more important than cutting government budgets.
There's been far too much baling out of institutions/banks and cutting of budgets to fund the bale outs. All the while, those who pay taxes are
suffering and the only return/support we all receive is the dole money we get when our employers/businesses fail and put us out of work.
Sorry was not lumping everyone on benefits into the one group of workshy fops, i totally agree with the basic philosophy of a benefit system, it was
merely targeting the work shy and spongers who don't deserve any kind of benefit and who have or will never contribute financially and probably
socially to this country
Cheers Austen
RGB car number 9
www.austengreenway.co.uk
www.automatedtechnologygroup.co.uk
www.trackace.co.uk
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MK9R
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 09:15 PM |
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Oh and i've had a bad few days, so using this rant as a bit of a venting tool!! 
Cheers Austen
RGB car number 9
www.austengreenway.co.uk
www.automatedtechnologygroup.co.uk
www.trackace.co.uk
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austin man
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 09:41 PM |
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What I find really annoying is the amount of vacancies there are out there and people refusing the work because "its not really what they want
to do" oh to be able to be so choosey. Ive just witnessed someone refusing to attend an interview for a £27k job because it could take and hour
to get there on a bad day
Life is like a bowl of fruit, funny how all the weird looking ones are left alone
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Confused but excited.
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 10:29 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by StevieB
That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
Now that would be an achievment. 
Tell them about the bent treacle edges!
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Andi
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| posted on 23/12/09 at 11:18 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Confused but excited.
quote:
Originally posted by StevieB
That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
Now that would be an achievment.
I think your on to something there. Schools could follow suit and cut off the summer holidays.........
Savings for all of society, and with full time jobs for tutors.
[Edited on 23/12/09 by Andi]
[Edited on 23/12/09 by Andi]
[Edited on 23/12/09 by Andi]
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SteveWalker
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| posted on 24/12/09 at 01:40 AM |
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quote:
There's been some talk of cutting the costs through reducing the length of a degree course. I think the best wayt o do this is to get
rid of summer holidays and just stick a 2 week break in there instead. That way you could squeeze 3 semesters into a year rather than 2.
That would reduce the cost of eductaion to the students/parents rather than the state, which IMHO is more important than cutting government budgets.
There's been far too much baling out of institutions/banks and cutting of budgets to fund the bale outs. All the while, those who pay taxes are
suffering and the only return/support we all receive is the dole money we get when our employers/businesses fail and put us out of work.
That won't work though - the Summer break is not non-work time for the lecturers. It is the time that they spend on their research projects ...
the ones that pull in funding from industry and venture capitalists and profits from discoveries. Without this, the university research system and
universities as a whole would simply collapse.
Reducing the length of degrees is not that good an idea at all though. Many other countries have four or even five year degrees and they regard our
three year courses as pitifully inadequate and therefore our graduates as second class.
The increased pressure of shortened courses would also cause problems for many students. Some courses may well be "lightweight," but by no
means all - when I did my degree twenty years ago, we were expected to attend 25 hours of lectures a week and carry out an additional 50 hours of
assignments, reading, etc. only lengthy holidays allowed us to spread some of this out rather than constantly struggling with it. On occasions we were
faced with nine separate six week assignments due in in the same week!
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RK
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| posted on 24/12/09 at 02:49 AM |
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No university level degree is a waste of time, and those that get them, consistently earn more than those that don't.
This is from studies based on a society that has not had a class based system for centuries - which sort of complicates things. So paying for
university students is a good thing in the long run for governments. You can't import ALL workers; some have to come from home to tell the
newcomers what to do!
On the other hand, your government is desperate. There is NO MORE MONEY. It has all been wasted on paying those uselessly educated people (who may
have Fine Arts degrees too) like doctors and nurses, treating those horrible elderly people. Get rid of the poor, the sick and the old, and your
financial problems disappear.
My own province is supposed to be the highest taxed place in the Western world, so I know where you're coming from.
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skodaman
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| posted on 24/12/09 at 03:41 AM |
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" Get rid of the poor, the sick and the old, and your financial problems disappear."
Jeez RK wasn't the last person proposing this a short,little Austrian guy?
Skodaman
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oldtimer
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| posted on 24/12/09 at 10:50 AM |
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I do like the idea of more 'useful' degrees having lower charges. I think waste in other areas, such as the NHS, is more serious, however.
The single teenage mother gets own home at tax payers expense is another issue that needs sorting quick smart. Only my thoughts
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RK
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| posted on 24/12/09 at 01:37 PM |
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My point is, there is no such thing as a less useful degree: they all pay off to society eventually, by the facts and figures indicating higher
earning by those holders.
And there have been many who thought exactly like that short little guy with the weird mustache, but they hide it under guise of "cuts needed to
Peter to pay Paul". It's all about who your political friends are.
I have no opinion on your present leaders and I have no right to because I don't live there!
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