karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 08:00 AM |
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Time to sort a few problems - Pinto
I have now got some time to try and sort some niggles with my Indy and the pinto.
3rd, 4th (5th?) gear wont rev past appx 3800 rpm. Have fitted a new coil as the old one looked, well very old and original, certainly seem to run a
little better now, but still stutters and splutters at around 3,800. Gonna try a Dist cap, new rotor arm, possibly ignition module next ? I dont
have timing equipment, but have had it checked and was told it was fine.
Gremlin no,2. The temp gauge seems to be a little lazy. Never seems to get fully into the norm temp range. I guess we have the thermostat, temp
sensor and the gauge itself - Standard Sierra dash. (Any ideas) ?
Also, the car has a swicth fitted on the dash for the Fan. This does not seem to always turn the fan on.... Is this correct ? I assumed it would
spin even if sitting idling or even on ignition....
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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adithorp
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 10:02 AM |
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1. Check the valve clearence. If they're too tight that'd give the symptoms you describe but be worse when the engine is hot. Could also
be fuel supply problem. Low fuel supply. have you changed the filter? What pump are you useing? Ignition side would effect it more as the revs pick up
(miss when you blip throttle) in most circumstances.
2. Sounds like the 'stat is stuck open. Do both rad hoses warm up soon after you start? If the stat is good the top hose would get hot but the
bottom stay cold and then heat up quick when the stat opens as the engine reaches running temp. Senders tend to just stop working.
3. Dash fan switch should just switch the fan on. Either there's a fault (switch, wiring or fan) or it's wired via a thermostatic switch
(in rad or a hose).
adrian
[Edited on 31/1/10 by adithorp]
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 10:50 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by adithorp
1. Check the valve clearence. If they're too tight that'd give the symptoms you describe but be worse when the engine is hot. Could also
be fuel supply problem. Low fuel supply. have you changed the filter? What pump are you useing? Ignition side would effect it more as the revs pick up
(miss when you blip throttle) in most circumstances.
[Edited on 31/1/10 by adithorp]
Many thanks, havent got as far as getting any spanners out to check clearances - would probably make a right horlicks of it 
It is using the standard fuel pump. I did have a mechanic sit by me in the car when it did it, he basically discounted fuel in the way it stutters.
It is almost at identical revs each time, and is like a rather vicious rev limiter, acompnaied by a bit of popping.
I will try some simple stuff such as cap and arm, then if it is still doing it, will try and "film" the problem using a new little cam i
just bought - see what u guys think. Heck of a lot easier seeing the fault rather than describing it....
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 10:54 AM |
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On the fuel pump, do you have a black plastic spacer fitted imbetween the pump and the block? Heard similar issues due to the stroke of the pump
getting hindered.
Cheers
Rich
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 10:57 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardK
On the fuel pump, do you have a black plastic spacer fitted imbetween the pump and the block? Heard similar issues due to the stroke of the pump
getting hindered.
Cheers
Rich
I will take a look later on. Is it good or bad to have the spacer ?..
I should have added that as well as being OK in 1st/2nd gears - It will also rev out in Neutral. Not sure what that means but may be relevant ?
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:00 AM |
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That's whats sort of got me thinking about fuel delivery, timing/ign doesn't care what gear its in.
Although popping is indicative of incorrect timing and would be definatly worth checking. What work has been done on this engine?
Yes you do need the spacer and I do have one spare and a spare pump if you need it, although I'm off on my jollies Tuesday so you'll have
to tell me sharpish if you need it so I can get it in the post.
Cheers
Rich
[Edited on 31/1/10 by RichardK]
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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dlatch
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:11 AM |
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it must be something to do with load the engine is under if its spluttering in higher gears.
what carb you running?
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adithorp
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:14 AM |
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If it was valve settings then I'd expect it to effect all gears and run rough reving in neutral. Doesn't rule it out but makes it less
likely.
Does sound fuel related. Will it do it in second on e steep hill?
If the pump is weak then removing the block will improve things. Its temporary fix only and get you home solution. If it does it's because this
gives the pump lever a bit more throw; Then replace the pump.
"A witty saying proves nothing" Voltaire
http://jpsc.org.uk/forum/
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karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:36 AM |
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* What work has been done on this engine?
I understand that the engine is standard - no tuning work done. That was my plan, but want it running right as standard first.
* Yes you do need the spacer and I do have one spare and a spare pump if you need it, although I'm off on my jollies Tuesday so you'll
have to tell me sharpish if you need it so I can get it in the post.
I looks like it does have a spacer fitted - though not really sure - see pic below....
* what carb you running?
Currently running a DGAV
* Will it do it in second on e steep hill?
Cant say I have tried it up a steep hill - live in Bedfordshire 
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:43 AM |
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Just out of interest do you have your vacuum pipe connected to the manifold or blocked off?
Has it just started doing this?
Sorry for all the questions!
R
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:54 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardK
Just out of interest do you have your vacuum pipe connected to the manifold or blocked off?
Has it just started doing this?
Sorry for all the questions!
R
No problems - ask as many questions as you like - You guys are helping me out afterall 
Not to sure what the vac pipe is - does this picture help ?
It has done it since I bought the car last September. Can only assume that it has been doing it for sometime before that - The guy I bought it from
had not used it for a long time.
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:57 AM |
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On your first picture just above the fuel pump on the side of the dizzy there is a circular gadget with a pipe coming off it, that the vacuum advance
pipe, check for splits and check it connected at both ends, thats what advances and retards your ign timing at differing revs.
Cheers
R
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 12:08 PM |
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I personally think you may have a couple of things that need looking at, firstly get your ign timing checked, just to see if it advancing and
retarding as it should (vacuum faulty.weights in dizzy stuck), then check the fueling, for blocked inline fuel filters and get a service kit for the
carb, the jetting could be out causing the problems, as these are unknown settings to you I think you should start there first and then work to more
complex things. You could keep an eye out for people upgrading to bike carbs and flogging there dgas's for a quick swap.
Not sure if its possible to turn that air filter around and duct it into the nose so forcing air into the carb, I personally would take it off while
messing about as well.
I'll get that fuel pump off to you tomorrow, just stick a couple of quid in the cancer charity box to cover my postage please.
Cheers
Rich
[Edited on 31/1/10 by RichardK]
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 01:47 PM |
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As already suggested the problem may well be caused by siezed auto advance weights in the distributor . Best way to check the timing is advancing
correctly is with a timing light . Another way is to advance the timing slightly and see if there is any improvement but don't over do it as too
much advance will cause problems. If it is siezed advace weights it's possible to strip the distributor and free them off.
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karlak
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 02:08 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by rusty nuts
As already suggested the problem may well be caused by siezed auto advance weights in the distributor . Best way to check the timing is advancing
correctly is with a timing light . Another way is to advance the timing slightly and see if there is any improvement but don't over do it as too
much advance will cause problems. If it is siezed advace weights it's possible to strip the distributor and free them off.
Thankyou
I dont have timing gear, but will get it checked. Would "sticky" weights not cause the problem in 1st and 2nd gear as well though ?
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 02:18 PM |
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Stranger things have happened but you need to make sure the fundamentals are correct before getting in too deep!
I kind of think that the vacuum is created by the manifold pressure which is proportional to the load the engine is under so in 1st and second there
maybe not that much load on the engine. Thats my thinking anyway and could be totally wrong but think its important to know the timing is correct
first.
Cheers
Rich
[Edited on 31/1/10 by RichardK]
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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rusty nuts
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 02:19 PM |
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Probably wouldn't be as noticeable in the lower geras . Have had this problem a few times with various cars .
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Angel Acevedo
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| posted on 31/1/10 at 11:56 PM |
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Axial play on Dizzy Rotor
Check for axial play on distributor shaft, this may cause erratic timing and also problems with counterweights, points not opening fully.
On the Fan Switch it may be connected in series with the thermostatic switch so it won`t turn the fan on unless it is above the Thermostatic switch On
temp.
HTH
Beware of what you wish.. for it may come true....
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karlak
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| posted on 1/2/10 at 08:28 AM |
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Thanks for all the suggestions guys. Have a week off work next week so weather permitting can have a good go at this.
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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RichardK
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| posted on 1/2/10 at 07:56 PM |
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That fuel pump should be with you too.
Gallery updated 11/01/2011
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karlak
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| posted on 23/2/10 at 07:41 AM |
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Just to revisit the problem with the engine and "revving" issues in the 3rd gear and higher.
Checked timing, tried new plugs, leads, cap, rotor -
Timing advances as expected, and the car certainly drives better now, albeit the revving issue remained.
So on Sunday afternoon went out for a drive and stopped off at my mates house. Decided to remove the home made air filter "effort" - Took
her back out and YES the rev problem has gone gone. It will now rev out in all gears. So it would appear the filter arrangement was choking it under
load at higher revs. I tried "blowing" through the filter hosing and it seems very free flowing, so dont suspect a blocked/dirty filter,
more likely a design issue.
I think someone mentioned this on an earlier thread (wish I had tried it then ). But at least I have learnt about the ignition and timing system -
Which is good.
So a good day, as I can now sell this engine on as a good working unit when I swap in the replacement pinto.
The only slight downer on the day was running out of fuel 500 yards from home. Must get that fuel sender fitted
[Edited on 23/2/10 by karlak]
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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sebastiaan
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| posted on 23/2/10 at 11:41 AM |
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A pinto 2l at 6000RPM will be gobbling air in at rougly 80 litres/second. I think you'd be able to empty your lungs (6L max?) in ~ 1,5 seconds,
so 4l/sec. 20 times less then the Pintosaurus, so blowing down a filter won't prove anything (unless you're doing it with 20 guys at once,
but that seems like a bit of a strange hobby ;-))
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Nomexnomad
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| posted on 25/2/10 at 11:33 AM |
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Definately get the induction sorted most cars of your setup have a pankcake style filter poking through the bonnet. If your going to change engines,
definately look at fitted twin side draft carbs, you can get a set on flea bay for £100 and the improvement will be noticeable
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Bass1st
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| posted on 1/3/10 at 08:02 PM |
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That mate of yours is a b****y genius!
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karlak
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| posted on 1/3/10 at 08:25 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Bass1st
That mate of yours is a b****y genius!
Hmmm, maybe. But then again if he was, perhaps he would have fixed his own engine quicker
MK Indy - 2litre Duratec - Omex 600 - Jenvey throttle bodies - ETB DigiDash2
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