whitstella
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 posted on 12/11/10 at 09:30 PM |
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car or bike engine??????
hi again,
can some of you experts out there give me pro's and con's in using a bike or car engine in my biuld????
which is an easier build etc. and prices of engines looking at 2l zetec dont know much about bike engine, any recomendations??? nice to here from you
all thanks steve.
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ReMan
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:31 PM |
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Ha Ha Ha !
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NigeEss
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:33 PM |
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Here we go again 
Use the search button it's been covered many, many times before.
Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.................Douglas Adams.
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carpmart
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:34 PM |
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Checks calendar, no not April 1st!
You only live once - make the most of it!
Radical Clubsport, Kwaker motor
'94 MX5 MK1, 1.8
F10 M5 - 600bhp Daily Hack 
Range Rover Sport - Wife's Car
Mercedes A class - Son's Car
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Canada EH!
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 posted on 12/11/10 at 09:37 PM |
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There goes the evening, and maybe all of next week.
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marcjagman
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:39 PM |
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Loads of price differences in car and bike engines. I am using a Honda CBR1000f engine/box. Weighs 98Kg, 135-145BHP standard but the best bit is 104Nm
of torque, ideal for a kit car. Bike cost £350 and is still taxed and tested till April next year. Sold the wheels, brakes, seat etc that I
didn't need and got most of my money back. There are some very expensive engines out there just depends how deep your pockets are.
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belgian2b
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:39 PM |
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Hello,
Things are quite easy :
you want a car , go for car engine
if you want a sport car, go for bike engine
Gerardo
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StevieB
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:46 PM |
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There's a million opinions about this subject, and they'll all be stated on this thread sooner or later - favourite
'discussion' on this forum
My views, however:
BEC Pro's:
Lighter (therefore faster)
6 sp sequential 'box built in
Easy to install (hand lift the unit in - don't need engine crane etc)
Generally more powerful out of the box than most car engines
screaming revs 
Cheap performance compared to what you'd need to spend on a car engine to get the same
Throw another unit in if anything ever goes wrong
BEC Con's:
No reverse gear, so need to fit something for IVA
High revs when cruising at speed (more a diff gearing thing really)
Emissions can be a PITA for IVA puposes (though plenty of people have done it so always a few tricks to be shared!)
CEC Pro's:
Torque!
Reverse Gear built into the gearbox
Plenty of tuning options available for most engines
Probably easier to drive at first than a BEC
Parts are maybe a little cheaper
CEC Con's:
Heavy (therefore slower)
Comparatively expensive to get the same performance as a bike engine
Need engine crane to install
Need engine crane to remove if anything goe's wrong
It really depends on what you want to use your car for and what it will be - my Indy and my upcoming midget are generally built for trackdays, with
the odd tour thrown in there too. So, I went for the bike engine option as it suited my purposes best (and I really like the screaming revs/paddle
shift/sequential 'box thing).
There's plenty cases for both options, so you need to think about what you want from the car and maybe sample examples of both engine types
before making a decision.
And, after what I think is a fairly pragmatic post - get a bike engine, you won't regret it. Car engines are slow and rubbish 
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RK
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 09:49 PM |
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I'll bite:
CEC
There that's out of the way.
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AdrianH
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 10:05 PM |
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It is a personal choice, buy yourself!
just ask yourself a few simple questions.
1) Do you want to race it, as in serious track days, sprints etc. Or do you want to drive it on outings and generally turn heads even enjoy fast blat
days, sometimes?
2) How good is your hearing now/age etc. i.e how much noise at high levels can you take.
3) Would you be going for a Age related, Q or New registration?
4) How good is your driving, seriously?
5) How good is your engineering skills and how easy do you want it on the road?
There are no correct answers just down to personal taste.
For example and being honest here of myself my answers were
1) my answer enjoy driving it on outings see also question 4.
2) I am loosing top end frequencies, was told is normal when start to reach 50 plus, but would like to keep what I have
3) Age related, you never know I may fancy a private plate sometime and new plates needs a cat and may need some emission controls.
4) I am an average driver, never been a boy racer, Moggi Minors and Austin 1100 were never that fast in my youth, buy the time I got the chance for
fast cars such as Jag's lost the need for speed and wanted comfort.
5) Reasonable, have lathe/milling/some cnc capabilities but wanted a relative easy book build, less time and hopefully less cash speant.
So for me car engine, doing 70 at 3,000 rpm not 5 to 6,000 rpm
It is easier/cheeper to keep the exhaust note quieter the less revs, going off a few on here, db killers or wadding or what ever is rammed up the
exhaust to keep the noise down for IVA kills the top end performance on bike engines and generally gets taken out after IVA equals very loud, or spend
decent money.
Generally cheaper to stick with donor options until after IVA enjoy your driving the see what you want to do.
If you want serious racing, there are more things needed then in the Haynes book so start to research them before your build gets to far started,
bulkheads or fire walls with no gaps. hoops or steel tunnels around the prop, type of roll bar/cage you will need, exhaust type may now need to be CAT
fitted?
Just a few thoughts, as said all personal reasons that need honest answers or you will be swapping and changing as the build continues.
Adrian
Why do I have to make the tools to finish the job? More time then money.
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matt_gsxr
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 10:15 PM |
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2litre zetec is a good choice if you are going CEC. Lots of experience, lots of upgrade routes, lots of off the shelf parts. Reliable, sturdy,
solid, able to reverse.
Bike engines are Marmite.
Very light (100-150kg lighter in total, once gearbox, battery, alternator, are taken into account)
Work surprisingly well (litre bikes have plenty of torque, but need driving differently to cars)
But these engines are a hi-tech wonderland and in many ways a bit mad (14krpm red line!).
Best options are the most popular variants, 2004 R1, zx10r, zx12 or hayabusa (all best bought from malc), going for rarer (cheaper) engines, is a
false economy unless you enjoy the journey.
CEC is generally cheaper than BEC
Have a ride in a BEC before you commit, they are mental.
In my opinion:
If you want a practical car, then don't build one
If you want an amazing/crazy car, then BEC (maybe turbo BEC) is one way to do it.
Matt
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LBMEFM
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 10:24 PM |
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I like Bike Engines and Marmite
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<&l
t;<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
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big-vee-twin
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 10:58 PM |
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Go for a powerful lightweight car engine like the 2.0 ltr Duratec.
Plenty of tuning options
Weighs around 100kg
Can get 200hp with throttle bodies
But like the Bike engine not the cheapest route
Duratec Engine is fitted, MS2 Extra V3 is assembled and tested, engine running, car now built. IVA passed 26/02/2016
http://www.triangleltd.com
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RazMan
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 11:12 PM |
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Ah , but I like Car engines and Marmite 
Cheers,
Raz
When thinking outside the box doesn't work any more, it's time to build a new box
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macspeedy
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| posted on 12/11/10 at 11:54 PM |
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dont build, buy one....... mine
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skodaman
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 12:09 AM |
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My Rover doesn't want to play at the moment even after fitting a new starter motor so right now I'd say any engine that works would be
fine.
Skodaman
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carpmart
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 07:04 AM |
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Why do you ask?
For sport? You have probably had enough now!
For information? Search my friend
To assist you making a decision? You will have no help here as there are devotees in both camps!
In summary, we are all a little battle worn and scarred on this topic!
You only live once - make the most of it!
Radical Clubsport, Kwaker motor
'94 MX5 MK1, 1.8
F10 M5 - 600bhp Daily Hack
Range Rover Sport - Wife's Car
Mercedes A class - Son's Car
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ReMan
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 07:28 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by carpmart
Why do you ask?
For sport? You have probably had enough now!
For information? Search my friend
To assist you making a decision? You will have no help here as there are devotees in both camps!
In summary, we are all a little battle worn and scarred on this topic!
SPOT ON!
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fesycresy
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 08:10 AM |
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Marmite XO
What was the question again?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up.
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martyn_16v
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 09:09 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by LBMEFM
I like Bike Engines and Marmite
Quite clearly a deranged mind 
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Hellfire
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 09:28 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by carpmart
....................... In summary, we are all a little battle worn and scarred on this topic!
Battle worn and scarred? Never.............
Lets deal with bike engines first.....
Pro’s
1 Performance - Standard bike engine and gearbox = more bhp/kg than your standard car engine and gearbox (in most cases) which makes for awesome
acceleration
2 Superb noise
3 Advanced Technology. How many normally aspirated 1,200cc car engines do you know that produce 180 Bhp?
4 Lightweight & compact= Easier to handle and no need for special lifting gear
5 Mechanically, they are easier to maintain. Clutch changes etc
6 Cheaper Vehicle Excise Duty (Tax, to you and me)
7 Far cheaper import tax (In case you ever consider emigrating to somewhere like……… Cyprus)
8 Smaller & easier to clean – therefore more environmentally friendly
Con’s
1 Standard bike engine is likely to be more expensive than your standard car engine
I haven't included 'no reverse gear' because that can be both a 'Pro' and a 'Con'
Now onto car engines (apart from Honda S2000)
Pro's
Nope, can't think of any. I'm really struggling on this one..............
Con's
1 Too heavy
2 Too slow
3 It's a car engine
So there you have it...... A definitive guide to the pro's and con's of BEC & CEC....... Now where's my flak jacket?
Phil
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alawrence
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 09:35 AM |
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I asked the same question some time ago and got the same reaction. Dont be put off by the wee taking....many people forget just how much they know
and think everybody else is up to the same level.
You have some good members here who will help you out so stick with it. If you dont know the answer then it aint a daft question. I know cause im an
expert at daft questions...
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speedyxjs
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 10:25 AM |
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You are all wrong! If i had to choose, i wouldn't waste any time considering the bike engine and id go for the car engine but i would reccommend
the Jag engine. Far superior than any other
Got my coat, bye!
How long can i resist the temptation to drop a V8 in?
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Strontium Dog
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 11:31 AM |
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Do like me and build BOTH at the same time.
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mrwibble
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| posted on 13/11/10 at 11:42 AM |
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rocket power anyone?
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