david_hornet27
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 06:35 AM |
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Which welder??
Hi Everyone,
After some research I want to buy a welder and teach myself/practice how to weld. Found some good 'welding for dummies' type advice but
not anything much on what would be a good machine to get started with.
In true Locost spirit I want to spend as little as possible, but the advice I have gleaned is to go for the most expensive you can afford!
I would like to approach this from a different angle and was hoping some of you could give me advice on what machines to look for and I will then try
to find a bargain price on whatever is suggested.
I am looking for MIG unless anyone advises otherwise, and will be welding/repairing chassis and engine mounts on my current Seven and future projects
rather than thin metal bodywork type welding.
Thanks in anticipation...
Dave
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 06:41 AM |
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From experience of a few budget machines, I would say clarke. I have a 150 jobbie, will easily handle 4mm, and 5mm if done slowly.
Mine is a gasless version, hated by many but it works great for me (have used both, gas is a little neater, gasless more forgiving of old cars and use
outside)
have you looked here?
http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/
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david_hornet27
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 06:50 AM |
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Thanks Clifty,
Yep that site is one of the first that came up on google and is really helpful! Thought I'd ask on here as you guys have used and have
knowledge of what is good and not good.
I would like to go gasless so I don't have to store and pay for bottles of gas but I was under the impression that it makes it harder to see
what you are doing and the welds aren't quite as neat. Really the only thing I am worried about is the strength of the welds though as they
will be hidden either under the car or under the bonnet.
Thanks for the reply.
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v8kid
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 07:43 AM |
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I think most of the cheaper welders use generic parts, control valves, motor drives etc and they are pretty flimsy and the control circuits are
poor.
Having said that there are plenty of sites that show you to upgrade. My welder is a cheapy I upgraded and it now welds acceptably but if I had my time
again I would pay twice as much for a inherently better MIG.
An option not often mentioned is TIG. The cheapo Chinese units on the market are ultra reliable - we use one for DC stick welding and it never fails.
Replace the crappy torch and it could be a good bet - I intend to try this route this winter (busy with other stuff) and will update.
Don't go gasless BOC offer a great hobbyist discount on Argoshield Light
Cheers!
You'd be surprised how quickly the sales people at B&Q try and assist you after ignoring you for the past 15 minutes when you try and start a
chainsaw
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AdamR
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 07:45 AM |
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Default answer is Clarke 151TE. Very popular choice on here and you can get away with running it at full power from a normal 13A supply.
I can;t comment on gasless MIGs as I've never used one, but I use the small 600G CO2 bottles and they last for ages. I welded my entire chassis
on about 3 or 4 of them.
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ashg
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 08:26 AM |
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im going to go against the trend here. most say the clarke 151 is good but its not. compared to something like a second hand looked after esab,
migtronic, miller, murex etc its a piece of crap. and all the ones i have mentioned can be picked up second hand for the same money or less as a new
clarke 151.
edit.
just to add i have a funny feeling that most of the people that think a clarke 151 is good have never welded with a good welder. a couple of people i
know have clarkes and after using my migtronic immediately sold them and got a proper welder.
and as for not buying Chinese crap where do you all think the clarke welders are made?
[Edited on 14/6/2011 by ashg]
Anything With Tits or Wheels Will cost you MONEY!!
Haynes Roadster (Finished)
Exocet (Finished & Sold)
New Project (Started)
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carlknight1982
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 08:33 AM |
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I have to agreee with ash, I had a siegen which is basically the same thing, then i went out and brought an admittedly older draper which (then) was
made by millers as a budget machine, 185A opn a 16A supply and its never faultered. get the biggest you can afford and can store, if your budget will
stretch go for a second hand kempi 
Logic will get you from a A to B
Imagination will take you everywhere.
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Benzine
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 09:03 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ashg
im going to go against the trend here. most say the clarke 151 is good but its not. compared to something like a second hand looked after esab,
migtronic, miller, murex etc its a piece of crap. and all the ones i have mentioned can be picked up second hand for the same money or less as a new
clarke 151
I've only welded with a 151 and I've got pretty good with it but it's faults are starting to stand out the better I get. I've
had to replace a few components on the 151 over the years which has been a bit of a pain and the earth lead is just too short. I seem to get a lot of
spatter regardless of wire thickness, gas, settings and cleanliness of the workpiece. I'd love to try a better machine (actually I'd like
to try one when I have the money for one  )
I wouldn't call it a piece of crap though, it does weld and there's no need for 3 phase. Are esab, migtronic, miller etc 3 phase? no idea
tbh
[Edited on 14/6/11 by Benzine]
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Davey D
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 09:31 AM |
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Ive got a Lincoln 250A mig welder at home. i run it from a 32A supply Would definately recommend one, but in no way is it a budget welder
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Stott
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 09:41 AM |
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I've experience of the small cebora one (snap on branded, this is also the weldstar autostar 135 - same machine) it was grief TBH, serves a
purpose (portable) but it wasn't great and there's more gas in a balloon than one of those poxy disposable cylinders.
I've used a cebora 180 (snap on) which is also the same as a weldstar autostar 180 and that was superb tbh. I eventually bought a Sealey
supermig 195 which I got for £100 s/h, put a new liner in it (£7) and it welds just like the cebora 180 now, it's really really good. It
won't run flat out on a 13A plug though but it'll go to 5 of 6 and tbh it'll melt the bloody car on 5.
I agree with ashg too - get something good or you will end up disheartened with welding and the quality of your work, although I have no experience of
the clarke welders so can't comment there specifically.
There is no substitute for trying before you buy so to speak. So if you know anyone with a decent set and someone with a budget set I'd try blag
a go on some scrap - take the same bits of metal with you to both and you'll get a direct comparison. I wanted a cheap as chips set but after
trying out the cebora 180 I had to come to terms with the fact I needed to spend a fair bit and get something good. It's a pleasure to use a
good one fair play.
I didn't like MIG really untill I got on a good set. I was lucky though and the S/H one came up through a friend.
HTH
Stott
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hughpinder
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 10:58 AM |
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If you are just doing small repairs and moving the odd bracket etc, you could consider a stick welder.
Advantages:
Much cheaper. (say for £80 for a decent clarke arc set from machine mart, against £230 for 151 mig)
You can weld in a draught without loosing your gas shield.
No gas rental required.
Better weld penetration for a given number of amps.
Welder is generally lighter and smaller if you have to move it around a lot.
Disadvantages
Slower (Only matters if you are doing a lot of welding), and more cleaning afterwards, but alternatively, you can get good welds on less well cleaned
steel, so less prep work.
Not so good on thin steel (but you said you don't need that).
You cant weld aluminium or stainless (well you can, but the cost of the rods is prohibative)
If you buy any of the clarke welders, promise you'll cut off the earth clamp and spend £3 or 4 at a decent welding shop for a decent one!
Just an alternative view
Regards
Hugh
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T66
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 11:24 AM |
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I know folk have suggested the Clarke 151turbo - Any of the Clarkes are up to the job, no feed problems, reliable and do what they should without
fuss.
My first mig was a 120a Clarke, and it single handed restored a very rusty Land Rover chassis without a problem
My SIP was a pain in the butt, feed problems galore even with a metal liner.
Now back to a Clarke 195turbo - For the money they are very good, with plenty spares if they go wrong either ebay or machine mart.
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trextr7monkey
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 03:54 PM |
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I'm by no means an expert but we had a few second hand units - SIP 130 stands out and some old Clarke thing that was gas/ gasless. We tried
little canisters and pub gas and was never perfectly happy with results then I discovered the work Cebora 2000 with a massive bottle of argo shield
and never looked back, standard of welding made a quantum leap over night I sold the home welder and now do it all at work!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14016102@N00/ (cut and paste this dodgey link)
Our most recent pics are here:
http://s129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/trextr7monkey/
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cliftyhanger
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| posted on 14/6/11 at 04:24 PM |
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Back on track here, what is the budget??
I agree, a DIY machine for £200 won't be as good as a pro machine, but my clarke welds pretty well, but I know its limitations.
My first machine was a clarke 90, brilliant for bodywork, and would do 2mm chassis stuff as well. The sip which replaced it was horrid from day one,
back to clarke and all is good.
Had a lincoln at one point, good welder, but found the gas mig a bit fussy for some of the work I do. Excellent on new stuff though.
Beware some of th eolder migs that have had a hard life. they can be a moneypit, but get a good one and it will be a bargain.
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