Will L
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 posted on 17/6/05 at 08:26 PM |
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Welding?!?!?!?!
I'm a complete and utter novice when it comes to welding, well some say my electrcal soldering is like welding.
Iv'e read mig is simplest to learn, but to be honest im on a budget and arc welders seem to be much cheaper.
Is arc welding a skill which i could practice and self learn to a good standard, where i could make a chassis for example??
Cheers for any help
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viatron
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| posted on 17/6/05 at 08:29 PM |
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Your much better off teaching yourself MIG (Metal Inert Gas). MIG welders can be had at reasonable money from the likes of machine mart etc. Stick
would be a bit to much for any thin wall stuff you want to need. Most people can get a decent MIG run with only a couple of hours preactise.
Mac
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DorsetStrider
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| posted on 17/6/05 at 08:44 PM |
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Mate I started my build on a budget too please learn from my mistake and DO NOT try to save a few pennies with an arc welder.... it will cost you
pounds in the end as it's really not suitable for the wall thicknesses you are talking about using on the locost.
My advice look for Mig welders on Ebay I bet you could pick a second hand on up for the same or similar price as a new arc welder. I know I did and
i've not looked back since.
now I'm just off to weld this final panel to my intergalatic star destroyer!
Who the f**K tightened this up!
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Danozeman
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| posted on 17/6/05 at 09:35 PM |
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Definatley mig mate. Arc is an arse to do and is not suited to this purpose.
Mig is a piece of cake. Theres plenty of decent second hand ones about in the freeads or loot etc. Thats the root im gonna take as mine has welded
its last weld i think. Plus i want a more powerful one.
Machine mart and places like that are good prices for the 130amp ones.
Dan
Built the purple peril!! Let the modifications begin!!
http://www.eastangliankitcars.co.uk
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Cita
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 03:45 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by DorsetStrider DO NOT try to save a few pennies with an arc welder.... it will cost you pounds in the end as
it's really not suitable for the wall thicknesses you are talking about using on the locost.
Meaning?
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gazza285
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 01:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Danozeman
Definatley mig mate. Arc is an arse to do and is not suited to this purpose.
Why not? Perhaps it is you that are not suited to arc welding.
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tks
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 02:38 PM |
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iff you have experience
you can do every thing with an arc one...
the only think that wy i should take the arc one is because normal horizontal weld go easy and fine..but try an vertical one..even with the right
(electrodes??//arc's?? its an pain in the arse..)
and with mig/mag its an easy task...
but the gas can be an problem. (to have an cheap source)
Tks
The above comments are always meant to be from the above persons perspective.
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shades
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 06:01 PM |
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I bought a complete chassi because of my previous experience with mig welding.
Stuck wire, wrong speed, wrong current, blown holes, mountain of gas bottles that are not recycleable... it was horrible
I can now manage small bits but unless very good at welding I would leave the chassi up to someone who will make a good safe job.
Just my opinion.
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britishtrident
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 07:53 PM |
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Mig is the simplest budget choice using an ******cheap****** stick MMA welder is a waste of time and a good one will cost you a lot more than a cheap
MIG.
If you buy a MIG go for a Sealey as they are the best at the extreme bottom end of the market.
From experience non pro SIP welders are ****, and welders sold by B&Q are badge engineered SIPs.
If you are really nervous about the quality of your welding braze the frame but the gas will cost you a lot more.
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cassidym
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 08:26 PM |
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Personally I prefer arc and oxyacetylene over TIG and MIG.
Will, I discovered that altho it is cheap and quick to get going with arc welding it is actually a very difficult skill to master properly - it is
considered as a dying art form, if you catch my drift.
In the same breath I know a few guys who have built their chassis using nothing but an arc welder. I've heard of a few guys who can do body
panels with an arc welder. I'm still trying to attain that level of perfection. I think it is fair to say that most of those who have attempted
building with an arc welder already had at least a few hundred hours of arc welding under their belts.
MIG is a bit more expensive but it is easier to get up to speed with. I feel and here I may get some flak that MIG is designed for those that are not
really interested in developing welding skills but wish to do some metalwork quickly and easily. Just to cover my butt, I should mention that altho
MIG is easy to start out with it'll also take time and practive to attain a high level of expertise.
If you do go for an arc welder also prepare yourself that you're going to fight warpage, distortion and burn thro all the way - the arc puts
down a lot of heat.
If you do go for a MIG - steer away from the gasless cheapies out there. Also be very cautious - MIG is a very deceptive process for us newbies; a
bead can look very beautiful while it's actually very weak with no penetration.
Which ever route you go, the best advice that I can give you is: a) do a course if you can, b) read up as much about the process you're going to
use, c) try to befriend someone who is in the welding trade or who at least knows a bit more than you do, offer him a few beers in exchange for a few
practical lessons - my buddy was suppose to teach me vertically uphill with a stick today but the weather absolutely sucks, d) burn rod as often as
you can and e) be unconventional as well - if they recommend a certan angle, try others and compare it to the standard; nothing is cast in stone.
Regards.
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gazza285
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| posted on 18/6/05 at 10:03 PM |
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cassidym, you have it 100%. Arc welding might be a dying art form in SA but over here its going strong, my work is 99% arc and the rest MIG and TIG,
but that's understandable as I'm working outside most of the time. People need to understand that MIG is not easy, but isn't hard to
make look good.
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Will L
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| posted on 19/6/05 at 08:56 PM |
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Thanks for all the replies guys, i did toy with the idea of buying a pre-built chassis but sooner or later i thought id need to be able to weld, so
making one would help.
One other thing ive seen alot of 90 amp mig welders on ebay would this suffice for making a chassis etc??
Cheers Will
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JoelP
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| posted on 19/6/05 at 09:50 PM |
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possibly, but i think that it is probably on the weak side. Mine is a 130 and it made my chassis ok, and when everything is on full it can get decent
results on 3 and 6mm bars. You dont need it on full whack to blow holes in 1.6 tubes 
where in the world are you?
[Edited on 19/6/05 by JoelP]
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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Will L
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| posted on 19/6/05 at 09:58 PM |
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Thanks for the advice, im in Blackpool, in the north west of england
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cassidym
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| posted on 20/6/05 at 08:29 PM |
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Will, Good Luck on your quest.
A word of warning tho, welding can be very very addictive! 
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NS Dev
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| posted on 21/6/05 at 01:11 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by gazza285
cassidym, you have it 100%. Arc welding might be a dying art form in SA but over here its going strong, my work is 99% arc and the rest MIG and TIG,
but that's understandable as I'm working outside most of the time. People need to understand that MIG is not easy, but isn't hard to
make look good.
was going to say exactly the same as the above (except the arc welding bit, I don;t do a lot of it now unfortunately, so when I do it takes me a while
to re-familiarise)
MIG is very easy to pick up badly!!! You can run a weld with your eyes shut at the first attempt, but to do it properly (i.e, make it strong) takes
plenty of practise.
When I did a lot of it, I was always more confident of my results with stick welding, as it is easier to control your pace with and I always felt was
more precise.
The main reason I stopped doing stick welding was that I worked in a prototype workshop and was told that I had to mig everything as that was the way
it would be done in production so the prototypes had to have the same treatment.
I was very nervous one day (this was when I was on college placement during my engineering degree) when I was asked to weld a very large and complex
bearing carrier/boss into a main frame for a machine we were developing. The carrier had taken the machinist nearly 5 days to make. I set the stick
welder up as I was confident I could do a perfect juob with it, and was then "corrected" by my boss at the time who said " the
factory doesn't have a stick welder so nor do we!!!!!" and unplugged it......................I then had to set up the mig and weld it
while he and the machinist looked on
Was spot on though, no distortion thank god, got the stitches in the right order, and the press fits all stayed in spec.....phew!!!
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