sgraber
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| posted on 22/12/06 at 06:05 PM |
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I'm really intrigued by your chassis shape and I think it has a lot of potential. It just looks 'fast' sitting still and
that's great. I would like to know about the sightlines for the driver and have you done any modeling or research into that and let me tell you
what I am thinking. The trouble right now is the side bar and the head, Your current seating is very upright. So why not recline the seating position
drastically and get the noggin below the bar? Then remove the crosstube in front of the passenger area, replaced by a triangulation brace forward.
That would open the sight line to the front, and lowering the head would give you a sight line out between your top tubes?
Just an idea....
Graber
Steve Graber
http://www.grabercars.com/
"Quickness through lightness"
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thomas4age
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| posted on 22/12/06 at 06:23 PM |
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I don't now how wide the area between the seats is, but MR2 MK1's have very slim tanks in the transmissiontunnel, maybe one of those would
fit your needs,
they're steel items so easily modified
here's a piccie
That would sureley be the best spot to put the tank cog wise and safetywise
Nice going there btw!
grtz Thomas
[Edited on 22/12/06 by thomas4age]
If Lucas made guns, Wars wouldn't start either.
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gttman
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| posted on 22/12/06 at 06:44 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by cloudy
I'm hugely lacking in space at the front end, I *might* manage it but it would be VERY close to a front impact, just a bit of a worry
James
Why is it a worry... it'll be better protected than a tank at the rear and further from the driver and no hot engine to ignite it!
And its not always the front of the car that takes the impact in a crash, you just as likelly to go backwards into a hedge or get hit from behind etc.
Andygtt
Please redefine your limits
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Doug68
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| posted on 23/12/06 at 08:56 AM |
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The thought with my previous post was to tip it so the flat was on the bottom.
I'm sure I've seen more than one trike with a beer keg as a petrol tank and those things are near indestructible (the keg that is)!
In my design the tanks on the floor behind the seats BTW, but I want to have 40L+ on tap.
Dick Bear has really neat pictures of doing it this way where he used 2 separate tanks.
Merry Christmas!
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erwe
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| posted on 23/12/06 at 08:16 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by cloudy
I was thinking of perhaps redoing the chassis when I got bored, and i'd like to loosely base the design on this:
James
Do you more information or pics of this desing?
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cloudy
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| posted on 23/12/06 at 11:12 PM |
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To answer your comments,
sgraber - many thanks, re: the seats - that's the current plan, but as you rightly point out reclining the seats may bring out serious visibilty
problems, at the moment it's fine - I will have to do a bit of experimentation when it's warm enough to get back out to the garage 
erwe: That car is an australian concept I can't remember the name - it's similar to the caparo T1, will post if i can think of it
EDIT: It's the "Hulme F1"
as regards the tank, it fits well where it is, and would be great for a logo, (see latest renders) - any comments on whether this is safe
'enough'
J
[Edited on 23/12/06 by cloudy]
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kb58
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 12:32 AM |
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I haven't read the entire thread, so maybe I missed it, but my only concern is how close the driver's head is to the side bars. As long
as the helmet isn't optional.
Other than that, I think it's fantastic.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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gttman
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 11:02 AM |
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Well the tank does have some chasis protection at the rear, my only real concern is that it is above the engine so if it does get damaged.......
But lets be realistic here, bikes have them above the engine, and many other kits have them completely unprotected and by the engine.... so if thats
what you want, go for it.
Now its been pointed out, Kb has a very good point about how close your head is to that top rail.
Andygtt
Please redefine your limits
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cloudy
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 01:27 PM |
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yeah its been pointed out numerous times, I have a few ideas - the only practical one so far is to step the curved tubes lower for the cabin but it
totally ruins the lines - Still scratching my head on this one.
tank would be behind the engine (over the diff)
J
James
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gttman
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 04:47 PM |
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How about lowering the top one 2inches or so and also the one below it by similar amount.
Have you also considered curving the lower bar to a similar shape to the upper one? I think that would compliment the lines well.
BTW It's looking awsome at the moment, great project.
Andygtt
Please redefine your limits
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cloudy
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 05:54 PM |
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the lower half has all been built as per my other version, I don't want to have to rip up any more than I have already..... 
James
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JoelP
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| posted on 24/12/06 at 06:24 PM |
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Id be happy with the tank there. Maybe use a fuel cell inside the metal tank? Dont know lots about them but some sort of tear proof tank sounds a good
idea 
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dr-fastlane
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| posted on 25/12/06 at 11:54 AM |
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Hello James,
Because I had nothing better to do on this Sunday morning. I did some brainstorming, how to get the upper curved tubes free from the driver’s head.
And not to disturb the lines of your buggy. Probably taking the upper tube higher, would be the only solution to not hit your head. And it makes it
easier to get in and out of the car. Perhaps you can do something with this idée.
Happy Christmas, greets Roy.
 
Rescued attachment roofless_sketch.JPG
------------------------------
I have not failed once. I have successfully found ways that will not work!
https://www.motor-forum.nl/threads/hardtail-dragstyle-project.343482/
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cloudy
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| posted on 25/12/06 at 12:03 PM |
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interesting approach, I'll have a play about with it - thanks
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akumabito
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| posted on 25/12/06 at 08:24 PM |
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I don't like the high bars..
Just make it a center-steered single-seater! 
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JoelP
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| posted on 25/12/06 at 09:00 PM |
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i like the high bars myself. I would also make it a centred single seater, but have a pair of 'seats' on either side (more like padding
and harnesses) so that you can still have passengers. I know a bec isnt ideal for a 3 seater but when theres no one in it, its only a few kilos extra,
and i think the centre driving position would make up for it - especially the better corner balance.
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cloudy
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| posted on 25/12/06 at 11:36 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by akumabito
Just make it a center-steered single-seater!
sooooooo tempting!
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Sven
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 07:33 AM |
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I wonder if you could cross those top two tubes or make a halo and join the front and rear to the halo?
-Steve
"Lightheadedness through quickness"
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designer
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 02:42 PM |
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This style has been done before
http://twintechcars.com/
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Alan B
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 03:40 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
......... I would also make it a centred single seater, but have a pair of 'seats' on either side (more like padding and harnesses) so
that you can still have passengers..........
Ohhh...sounds familiar...
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JoelP
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 03:51 PM |
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must be a good idea then! I have plans from '04 and a lawyer at the ready! lol
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cloudy
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 04:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by designer
This style has been done before
http://twintechcars.com/
that's awfully malproportioned, not keen!
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Ratman
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| posted on 26/12/06 at 11:54 PM |
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I like this chassis. I like the high bars. When you compare frame designs, ask yourself, which one whould I prefer to be strapped into when the car
rolls through the fence and down a bank. High bars win. Note that F1 cars have special inserts each side of the cockpit to limit the sideways movement
of the helmet. Obviously the bars will need to be padded. I like the idea of making the finish shape of the car in the frame. But this can have weight
liabilities if the resulting frame shape gets compromised when it comes to getting ridged support to the suspension etc mounting points. Permission to
rave sir? My preferred concept is (a) make the suspension and engine mounts and seat mounts and roll-over protection frame. (b) locate all these in
space. (c) joint them all with straight tubes (d) make it all triangles with extra tubes (e) make closed solid shapes (pyramids etc) with more tubes
to give torsional stiffness (f) then start making compromises and contrivences so there is actual space the the engine and driver etc... but try not
to compromise the step (e) structural achievements. Shouldn't need to use anything stronger than 20mm ms tube with 1.6 wall. Might not look so
svelt, but gets best stiffness for weight. Cheers, Brian
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kreb
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 03:46 AM |
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If I may chime in, the overall design is quite pleasing to the eye, but as has been previously noted, the high side bars are lethal. Also very
important is that they'll be a distraction and create a claustrophobic effect. If you've a light car, it should feel light, not like a
coffin. Don't be a slave to fashion.
https://www.supercars.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/1966_FiatAbarth_1000SP1.jpg
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kb58
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| posted on 27/12/06 at 06:12 AM |
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The side tubes appear to be at eye-level. If so, the driver has no peripheral vision, and to see what coming from the sides means raising or lowering
the head to see above or below them.
Mid-engine Locost - http://www.midlana.com
And the book - http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/midlana/paperback/product-21330662.html
Kimini - a tube-frame, carbon shell, Honda Prelude VTEC mid-engine Mini: http://www.kimini.com
And its book -
http://www.lulu.com/shop/kurt-bilinski/kimini-how-to-design-and-build-a-mid-engine-sports-car-from-scratch/paperback/product-4858803.html
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