luke2152
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 01:48 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jeffw
Look like a She driving the Lambo and it certainly seemed to be the Mazda's fault.
LHD
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ravingfool
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 02:19 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by blakep82
quote:
Originally posted by ravingfool
Definitely the lambo's fault.
Doesn't matter whether the mazda was imprudent or otherwise pulling out as the Lambo ends up hitting him, not the other way round ergo the mazda
is in front on the road and if you drive into anything in front of you it's automatically your fault.
If he was only doing the speed limit then there was no need to crash at all, whatever the mazda was doing.
Idiot.
lol
so if i sit at a junction, pulling out theres a car about 8m away, making sure he goes into the side of me, then i get a new car on his insurance,
even with video evidence he drove out in front of me leaving zero reaction time?
doesn't seem right...
of course with only about 2m space by the time i'm in front, if he's going bang on the speed limit, theres no need to crash at all. in
fact, i'll do it on a dual carriageway, do a proper job on the car?
doesn't really work, does it? 
if zero reaction time and being able to stop in an instant was possible, i might agree, but its just not
It was a general comment. For speed. Not meant to be taken to illogical extremes. But your statement doesn't work either; if you're
driving along and you see someone creeping towards the road you would slow down because you'd be worried that they might pull out. If you
didn't then don't be surprised if you have lots of accidents. This is not a dual carriageway obviously if you pull out in front of
traffic doing 70mph you're going to be done for dangerous driving!
It doesn't look like that's what happens here. Mazda definitely reacts (turns wheels and nearly stationary), lambo doesn't react at
all when presumably he should have been able to see this mazda creeping across the junction and he should have at least slowed to a speed from which
he could stop if necessary (I bloody would have to avoid any chance of an accident). If the mazda reacted, the lambo should have had time too.
This is a busy part of central London and 30mph frankly is too fast for this area, lots of traffic, cars constantly joining from minor roads and
rejoining from being parked. I've never had an accident round driving or cycling around there but I'm not surprised to read about plenty
of accidents happening.
Read elsewhere that the lambo driver is being charged with dangerous driving but I don't have a reference for that so make of that what you
will.
[Edited on 1/4/14 by ravingfool]
[Edited on 1/4/14 by ravingfool]
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jeffw
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 02:52 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by luke2152
quote:
Originally posted by jeffw
Look like a She driving the Lambo and it certainly seemed to be the Mazda's fault.
LHD
Just watched it full screen and you are correct of course.
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Slimy38
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:00 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ravingfool
lambo doesn't react at all...
Absolutely, that's the bit that's most surprising. I expected to hear tyres squealing as they stamp on the brakes, or the loud groan of
ABS hammering the s**t out of the brakes.
To me that is a sure sign that they have no idea how to properly drive that car, especially in a built up area.
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sdh2903
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:17 PM |
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purely speculating but as it's a LHD and being so low down is it possible the Mazda was in the blind spot of the A pillar? Would explain the
lack of braking? I haven't been lucky enough to spend any time in an aventador to know for sure
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ravingfool
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:22 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Slimy38
quote:
Originally posted by ravingfool
lambo doesn't react at all...
Absolutely, that's the bit that's most surprising. I expected to hear tyres squealing as they stamp on the brakes, or the loud groan of
ABS hammering the s**t out of the brakes.
To me that is a sure sign that they have no idea how to properly drive that car, especially in a built up area.
I think you're right.
I also think I should have kept my head in my shell today, as I've been taking a hammering for my opinion both here and on Jalopnik for standing
up for the mazda driver!
In my opinion: This is a busy part of London with traffic constantly merging and you don't get to continue just because you have right of way.
Drivers pulling out in front of you is a given in London. Mazda pulled out and then adjusted it's steering and slowed to stop when the danger of
a lambo was seen - whether it was seen late because the lambo was speeding or because vision was obstructed or the driver wasn't paying adequate
attention is irrelevant. The mazda clearly changes course and the video seems to indicate that the lambo driver either wasn't watching where he
was going or was going too fast to react. That's either dangerous driving or driving without due care and attention (nevermind the fact that I
feel he's driven into the rear of the mazda - and I won't bother continuing to argue the merits of that one here!).
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ravingfool
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:26 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by sdh2903
purely speculating but as it's a LHD and being so low down is it possible the Mazda was in the blind spot of the A pillar? Would explain the
lack of braking? I haven't been lucky enough to spend any time in an aventador to know for sure
Just spent the last few days driving a LHD renault of some sort through London as it happens (out-laws visiting). Although not an aventador,
visibility isn't any worse to the right than to the left but the mazda in this case should have been visible through the windscreen of the
aventador as he was approaching. If he couldn't see something like the mazda pulling out into the middle of the road then either his vision of
the road was obstructed (and he should have been driving slower) or he was too busy doing something else and not paying enough attention?
Took him a long time to get out - was he picking his phone up off the floor after dropping it in the crash? 
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kj
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:31 PM |
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Lambo driver at fault wide car LHD and a blond in the passeenger seat, bad combination
Think about it, think about it again and then do it.
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Slimy38
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:45 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ravingfool
Drivers pulling out in front of you is a given in London.
LOL, definitely agree with that one!! That's why I always take the train!
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kingster996
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:49 PM |
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quote:
Took him a long time to get out - was he picking his phone up off the floor after dropping it in the crash?
Either that or zipping
his pants back up - the blonde did look a tad flustered
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kj
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 03:53 PM |
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First time i have seen a car on one wheel
Think about it, think about it again and then do it.
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sdh2903
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 04:02 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by kj
Lambo driver, wide car LHD and a blond in the passeenger seat, bad combination
Doesn't sound too bad to me
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SteveRST
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 04:57 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by ravingfool
That's either dangerous driving or driving without due care and attention (nevermind the fact that I feel he's driven into the rear of
the mazda...).
You keep saying 'driven in to the back of...' but it's right there on video. This the moment of impact and no-one has driven in to
the back of anyone. I would say that a Mazda has driven in to the wing/side of a lambo.
Parked car on left - so no avoidance posibilities there.
[Edited on 1/4/14 by SteveRST]
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scimjim
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 05:18 PM |
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Just watched it full screen - the Mazda doesn't change speed or turn (until impacted) IMO.
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BangedupTiger
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 05:36 PM |
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What an absolute waste, that Mazda looked mint.
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JoelP
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 07:21 PM |
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I think the lambo driver has seen the mazda creeping out and assumed that he was going to pull out behind him, then tried to drive round him as the
gap narrowed, and realised too late that the MUPPET in the mazda was actually in a say dream and had failed to give way.
Ravingfool, without getting on your case, I'm quite alarmed that anyone with a driving licence could think that the mazda is not to blame. Are
you in the habit of pulling out in front of people like that?
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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coyoteboy
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 07:44 PM |
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quote:
If you look at the video the mazda doesn't appear to be going across at speed or wrecklessly.
It pulled out immediately into the path of another vehicle. That's pretty reckless.
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james h
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 07:53 PM |
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It seems clear to me that the mazda driver was not paying enough attention. Even if the lambo was speeding (not sure why that is assumed by most
people, would we be thinking the same if it was a focus instead?), the mazda driver should be sharp enough to judge the speed of the traffic and merge
in behind.
I also think the lambo driver was not paying enough attention. Given the speed the mazda driver pulled out of the junction, anybody who is scanning
the road ahead would be able to give themselves plenty of time to slow down and avoid a collision.
Neither driver is faultless in this incident - if either one of them was paying proper attention this wouldn't have happened, as can be said
about any avoidable collision I guess. Unless other evidence comes to light, from this video I'd hazard a small wager on the insurance outcome
being 50/50.
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JoelP
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 07:59 PM |
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No chance of it being 50 50 unless something significant is laid at the lambo drivers door. This is a classic case failing to give due priority.
Beware! Bourettes is binfectious.
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ian locostzx9rc2
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 08:44 PM |
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Mazda pulled out of a side road and the Lamborghini tried to get out of the way but hit the two parked cars it may have been speeding!
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james h
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 08:52 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
No chance of it being 50 50 unless something significant is laid at the lambo drivers door. This is a classic case failing to give due priority.
You may be right. Perhaps I was apportioning fault with insurance to closely. I guess insurance doesn't always work the way we like it.
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perksy
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 09:33 PM |
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The Mazda viewing position is higher than the Lambo and the Mazda driver didn't see it coming and pulled out imo
It was Black after all
That's why all drivers of 7 type cars need to be careful out there folks !!!
I'm sure we've ALL had it happen at one time or another....
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ravingfool
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| posted on 1/4/14 at 11:24 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by JoelP
I think the lambo driver has seen the mazda creeping out and assumed that he was going to pull out behind him, then tried to drive round him as the
gap narrowed, and realised too late that the MUPPET in the mazda was actually in a say dream and had failed to give way.
Ravingfool, without getting on your case, I'm quite alarmed that anyone with a driving licence could think that the mazda is not to blame. Are
you in the habit of pulling out in front of people like that?
Ha, no. But neither am I in the habit of driving into cars that have (foolishly, recklessly or otherwise) blocked the road because I'm doing an
appropriate speed for the conditions. What about you, without getting on your case?
I've never said the Mazda is without fault. What I'm saying is the Mazda must have obviously been in the way and only an idiot would drive
into it.
If it takes an idiot then he must be at fault because it was avoidable.
I drive in London regularly and there are a lot more cars than most other parts of the country so you see a lot more idiots too. Both of these look
like being likely examples.
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hughpinder
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| posted on 2/4/14 at 06:55 AM |
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Personally I'd go 50 50 on that one -
The mazda fails in his duty to ensure that it is safe before pulling out (it is his responsibility regardless of the speed of the user on the road he
is pulling on to, how good visibility is etc). He doesn't seem to take avoiding action to me -it looks like he was lining up to pull in behind
the lambo.
The Lambo seems to be doing 40 ish so probably too fast for the conditions, but I don't know the speed limit there -he may not have been
technically speeding- Hes doesn't appear to brake before the accidednt, so I'd guess he saw the mazda, decided there was room to pass(
obviously a bad judgement), but misjudged the width of his car (it was a LHD and he hit the other side of his car). Also note - It is less than 2
seconds from the car starting to pull out to the accident so not a lot of time.
Just out of interest - I saw a summary of 5 years worth of accident investigations in the uk (where serious injury or deaths occured) - 20% of cases
had "didn't see the other vehicle" listed as one of the major causes, only 13% had "excessive speed" listed - and of
those 2/3 were "excessive speed but below the speed limit".
I was recently talking to the accident investigation for the NE UK, and he was telling me how long it takes to make the decision to brake - in
'easy' cases its quick, e.g you instantly know you have to brake, but as soon as some decision making has to occur - is there enough room
etc, it is often seconds before people brake. A good example of this is the multi vehicle pile ups - people think there is a gap to one side or the
other so don't start to brake straight away....
Regards
Hugh
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Irony
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| posted on 2/4/14 at 08:09 AM |
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Lot of post for a simple subject.
I drive in London all the time and I am constantly amazed at the stupidity of drivers and pedestrians. They pull out if there is a hint of a gap.
The Mazda driver wasn't going very fast at all and I think the Lambo driver should have been able to stop that great car on a penny at 30-40mph.
I think the Mazda driver saw a small gap and pulled out as all London drivers do. The Lambo driver thought to himself 'cheeky bas%$£d'
and tried for the even smaller gap. The Lambo wasn't breaking until after the initial impact.
Both twits if you ask me.
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